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chiefstoker

Member Since: 11 Oct 2010
Location: Weston-super-Mud
Posts: 897

Cool, glad youre sorted

a pat on the back for YLR trevor and simon style! 2005 TD5 90 Hard Top

Beer 'n Sex 'n Chips 'n Gravy

16th Mar 2012 7:39pm

markb110

Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2660

Nice one Bob

Now go and win the challenge - no pressure mate

Best wishes

Mark

16th Mar 2012 7:49pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2719

Am I missing something here? I was under the impression that the transfer box as used on the current day Tdci Defenders is the same basic unit that Land Rover have been using since the early 1980s? Was it a part in the actual transfer box that failed, or the output shaft of the main gearbox...which interfaces through splines with the input gear inside the transfer box?

Assuming it is the transfer box, then presumably something has changed with the design of the LT230, as it's just about the strongest part of the drive train in a Defender. Early (up to 1997 or so) boxes had problems with accelerated wear between the input gear and the output shaft of the main box, but this was fixed in later models with a cross-drilled input gear.

And why the secrecy? I don't understand what could have failed that wouldn't be suitable for public broadcast.

16th Mar 2012 9:00pm

warren

Member Since: 14 Oct 2009
Location: East Lancs.
Posts: 903

2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Santorini Black

bob neville wrote:

Basically, all the splines on the end of the main shaft of the transfer box had worn away,...

This happened to mine. It had only done about 17k at the time and had never been off road...

16th Mar 2012 9:56pm

bpman

Member Since: 21 May 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 8069

2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SVX Station Wagon Santorini Black

Retroanaconda wrote:
why the secrecy?

sorry mate, can't tell you

if you re-read the post, the theory is the mechanics have stayed the same but the torque output has increased over the years and the original design is simply not upto the job

16th Mar 2012 10:26pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2719

What about all the LT230s behind big yank V8s and large lumpy diesels?

Not saying that scenario isn't the case, it's just kinda hard to figure out what's failed when we can't be told what's failed...

16th Mar 2012 10:38pm

ZeDefender

Member Since: 15 Sep 2011
Location: Munich
Posts: 4731

2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Baltic Blue

Retroanaconda wrote:
What about all the LT230s behind big yank V8s and large lumpy diesels?

Not saying that scenario isn't the case, it's just kinda hard to figure out what's failed when we can't be told what's failed...

I know - I hate it when people won't tell you why they can't tell you because if they did, it would be telling

bpman wrote:
the theory is the mechanics have stayed the same but the torque output has increased over the years and the original design is simply not upto the job

I was also puzzled by the "secrecy" - is that all it is?
If you say you can't tell me, I'll throw my slipper at you

Tell someone you love them today because life is short.
But shout it at them in German because life is also terrifying and confusing...

16th Mar 2012 11:02pm

warren

Member Since: 14 Oct 2009
Location: East Lancs.
Posts: 903

bpman wrote:
Retroanaconda wrote:
why the secrecy?

if you re-read the post, the theory is the mechanics have stayed the same but the torque output has increased over the years and the original design is simply not upto the job

I've heard the same theory on more than once occasion. I too asked about the V8s, but apparently they don't have as much torque low down like the pumas.

Having said that there's plenty of pumas that work very hard for a living, yet this issue seems quite rare.

16th Mar 2012 11:11pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2719

Okay, so case in point would be the Mazda SL35Ti. Produces 377Nm of torque, 17Nm more than the Tdci, and fitted to thousands of Range Rovers in the 80s (and subsequently many Defenders) without issues. Quite a few LT77 and LT85 main boxes have succumbed to them from what I've heard, but never heard of a transfer box giving up.

16th Mar 2012 11:22pm

ZeDefender

Member Since: 15 Sep 2011
Location: Munich
Posts: 4731

Retroanaconda wrote:
Produces 377Nm of torque, 17Nm more than the Tdci

Assuming no tuning... it's relatively easy to get another 50Nm+ out of a Puma (or more with uprated intercooler etc.)
Maybe there's a good reason why LR limit these things

Tell someone you love them today because life is short.
But shout it at them in German because life is also terrifying and confusing...

16th Mar 2012 11:36pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2719

Of course, quite agreed. I'm sure with some tweaking of the pump the Mazda engine would give extra power as well.

But my point is that LT230s have been putting up with engines that are more powerful, more torquey and a lot less refined than the current unit for over 20 years. So something must have changed for them to be failing.

16th Mar 2012 11:40pm

ZeDefender

Member Since: 15 Sep 2011
Location: Munich
Posts: 4731

Retroanaconda wrote:
So something must have changed for them to be failing.

a) I hope you're right; and
b) I hope mine or yours isn't one of them...

p.s. LR Deutschland still haven't replied about the manufacturing plants - wonder how they'll squirm out of answering

Tell someone you love them today because life is short.
But shout it at them in German because life is also terrifying and confusing...

17th Mar 2012 12:01am

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2719

ZeDefender wrote:
Retroanaconda wrote:
So something must have changed for them to be failing.

a) I hope you're right; and
b) I hope mine or yours isn't one of them...

p.s. LR Deutschland still haven't replied about the manufacturing plants - wonder how they'll squirm out of answering

Probably by just not answering!

Hopefully my transfer boxes should be OK, I'm only running Tdis and soon to be the aforementioned Mazda

17th Mar 2012 12:04am

bob neville

Member Since: 30 Apr 2009
Location: Marbella
Posts: 3248

Retroanaconda wrote:
I was under the impression that the transfer box as used on the current day Tdci Defenders is the same basic unit that Land Rover have been using since the early 1980s?

And why the secrecy?

Is it ? Ashcroft have just released one specific to the 2.4 engined puma

I posted the details about the part that failed, the rest of the conversation between the dealer and myself is between them and I.

Bob 2015 Jaguar XE240 R Sport - goes like ....... !!
2013 Defender 90 CSW - sold
2009 Defender 110 Double Cab - sold
2001 TD5 90 CSW - offroad project - sold to a forum member
2011 Porsche Boxster - for the sunny days !

18th Mar 2012 10:11pm

bm52

Member Since: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Kent
Posts: 2189

2014 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Havana

bob neville wrote:
Retroanaconda wrote:
I was under the impression that the transfer box as used on the current day Tdci Defenders is the same basic unit that Land Rover have been using since the early 1980s?

And why the secrecy?

Is it ?

I posted the details about the part that failed, the rest of the conversation between the dealer and myself is between them and I.

Bob

well, that's a cliff-hanger comment!

BM52

18th Mar 2012 10:16pm

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