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blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17450

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

In 2011 my local friendly main dealer quoted me for the supply and fitting of a new clutch, the replacement of the front diff pinion oil seal, and the replacement of the gasket on the "pto hole" on the transfer box. The price quoted for all of this was just lover £2,400 !! Yes, really, two thousand four hundred pounds!

If you talke off £400 for the VAT, £300 for parts (which was about what they cost at the time), that leaves £1700 for labour, which was about 20 man-hours at the dealer rates at the time. Needless to say, they didn't get the job.

I believe that the top-secret official repair times manual gives approx 4 man-hours as the labour required for a Puma clutch change, which is also about what I would estimate for a competent person based on the number of times I have done the job. It really isn't a huge job with the right facilities.

If your £500 included the parts I'd say it was a bargain (or a cowboy). If it didn't include the parts I'd say it is not unreasonable for an indy, and cheap for a main dealer.

I would expect an output shaft change to add perhaps an hour to the time since it means splitting the transfer box from the gearbox (which requires draining the transfer box), removing the output extension housing, and removing the shaft, and removing the drive member from the back of the gearbox. I am surprised that you have been told that there is no difference in the price for doing this, and would be inclined to query why not. You are either being overcharged for the clutch, or undercharged for the shaft!

23rd Sep 2019 9:45pm

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17450

Bluest wrote:
I would take view when you can see your current one. If it looks ok, I’d replace with another standard one, which are relatively cheaper. If it looks badly worn, go for an Ashcroft. Either way, unless there were absolutely no signs of wear, I wouldn’t put the old one back. Just my opinion on what I would do.

If it looks ok and is not worn, I suggest that there is no point in replacing it. In fact, since we don't know why the things fail (although the most likely underlying cause is an alignment issue) it is possible that some shafts are actually defective, in which case you may be better off not replacing one which you know has been ok for 100k.

Whatever you do, if you fit the old one or a new standard one, grease it thoroughly (preferably with molybdenum disulphide grease) before putting it all back together. If an Ashcroft one, lubricate it with gearbox oil.

23rd Sep 2019 9:50pm

deaallen

Member Since: 15 Feb 2016
Location: Basingstoke
Posts: 264

2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 SW Santorini Black

blackwolf wrote:
In 2011 my local friendly main dealer quoted me for the supply and fitting of a new clutch, the replacement of the front diff pinion oil seal, and the replacement of the gasket on the "pto hole" on the transfer box. The price quoted for all of this was just lover £2,400 !! Yes, really, two thousand four hundred pounds!

If you talke off £400 for the VAT, £300 for parts (which was about what they cost at the time), that leaves £1700 for labour, which was about 20 man-hours at the dealer rates at the time. Needless to say, they didn't get the job.

I believe that the top-secret official repair times manual gives approx 4 man-hours as the labour required for a Puma clutch change, which is also about what I would estimate for a competent person based on the number of times I have done the job. It really isn't a huge job with the right facilities.

If your £500 included the parts I'd say it was a bargain (or a cowboy). If it didn't include the parts I'd say it is not unreasonable for an indy, and cheap for a main dealer.

I would expect an output shaft change to add perhaps an hour to the time since it means splitting the transfer box from the gearbox (which requires draining the transfer box), removing the output extension housing, and removing the shaft, and removing the drive member from the back of the gearbox. I am surprised that you have been told that there is no difference in the price for doing this, and would be inclined to query why not. You are either being overcharged for the clutch, or undercharged for the shaft!

That wasn't including parts! I've been told to expect anywhere between £300 - £500, Alive quoted for between 3-5 hours @£60ph inc Vat but they are quite far from me

24th Sep 2019 6:46am

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 498

2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Keswick Green

Hi folks, any known issues with the Ashcroft shaft so far? I'm on Ashcroft for 2 years / 20000 km and no issues so far

26th Sep 2019 9:49pm

EastFreo

Member Since: 24 May 2014
Location: Perth
Posts: 103

I am bloody torn on this subject. I am at 148,000km and have had no issues. Car is a 2014 110 and does a combination of daily drive into city and then weekend drives to our farm (where it gets a good work out in muddy fields etc).

Probably come down to when I next take the family for a long holiday drive.

I don’t mind breaking down on my own but I would never hear the end of it if it happened on a holiday!

I think I will go the Ashcroft option.

20th Sep 2020 1:14pm

Notyalc

Member Since: 27 Jul 2018
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 161

But now you have the LOF option too.

Guaranteed for life...

20th Sep 2020 2:16pm

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 498

Julie wrote:
Hi folks, any known issues with the Ashcroft shaft so far? I'm on Ashcroft for 2 years / 20000 km and no issues so far

Hi - 3 yrs / 35 000 km - no issues

20th Sep 2020 4:49pm

Maddover

Member Since: 04 Sep 2015
Location: Christchurch
Posts: 1

2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Fuji White

Took vehicle in for service before a trip way for Xmas and got the dreaded comment in the service report of the telltale rust marks on the inspection hole, which would also explain the transmission clunk. Have already has one output shaft fail in the middle of a roundabout and not keen to have anther holiday ruined this year - COVID did the first one thanks, so decided to bit the bullet and replace the output shaft before total failure. The Ashcroft unit seemed the best option given the LR upgrade seems to have started to fail after 35,000km. The Ashcroft unit is being fitted tomorrow so will be interested to see how it performs.

7th Dec 2020 7:03am

fantomas

Member Since: 10 May 2020
Location: nord
Posts: 1

2011 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SVX Station Wagon Havana

just installed the mt82 aschroft kit on my defender 90 the transformation is radical. with that, I also replaced the clutch with a reinforced loft clutches
since then i don't know why i have vibrations when the engine is around 1400 rpm and i don't know where it might be from with these changes. I also replaced the front and rear driveshafts but it's the same
does anyone have an idea on the question

5th Jan 2021 8:37pm

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17450

Maddover wrote:
... given the LR upgrade seems to have started to fail after 35,000km. ...

Can I ask what you mean by the "LR upgrade"? As far as I know the genuine part has never changed, all that changed was the addition of a meagre smear of some peculiar lubricant.

6th Jan 2021 9:08am

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 498

Upgraded may indicate that JLR put some grease

What they did not do on my MY2012

And they refused any compensation despite the modified (upgraded) installation procedure. Their online commercials didn't even understand that spliced joints have to be greased.

One could think they're not car manufacturers but housewifes

16th Jan 2021 8:31pm

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17450

^^^ I think that might upset a few housewives!

16th Jan 2021 9:51pm

keith

Member Since: 15 Aug 2012
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 2214

Here we go AGAIN. 5th shaft just gone, awaiting recovery, 110,000 miles. A9.

2nd Jan 2022 1:00pm

Caterham

Member Since: 06 Nov 2008
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 6300

2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey

really so sorry to hear this Keith.
I really do feel your pain.

I so wish there was a sensible solution out there.

do me a small favour. when convenient would you check from underneath that the transfer box is fully engaged in 'unlock' position. from my experience the just because the transfer light isn't illuminated and the transfer box lever is pushed as far as it can go this does not guarantee the tab on the transfer box is fully in the 'unlock' position. That being the case, from my experience you can expect all sorts of minor problems including premature wear - not least of the transfer shaft.

I hope it all gets resolved as painlessly as possible - relatively speaking.

good luck with the mechanical and psychological results.

how does something so apparently straight forward cause so much of a problem?
and hence my query of trying to loose the adapter shaft all together by fitting a different gearbox - a solution that I've not yet found a solution to

2nd Jan 2022 1:50pm

keith

Member Since: 15 Aug 2012
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 2214

Aaaaargh No you don’t Cat. 5 times cmon man. Just as well I bleed green and got deep pockets. That’ll be another £1500. Just arrived in Mcduies Aviemore. Ha ! In a Tesla.

Click image to enlarge

2nd Jan 2022 4:47pm

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