 | Home > INEOS Grenadier > Ineos in talks with Daimler to build Grenadier in France |
 
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| Philip Member Since: 09 Mar 2018 Location: England Posts: 510  
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9th Dec 2020 6:33pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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Well I can't speak for Foers Engineering Ltd, but from the little I do know, or have gleamed, they are a similar small manufacturing setup as yourself.
There's a new website in the works, although I have no details on the timescale. http://www.ibexautomotive.com/ I see them being more of a Saville Row outfitter for a genuine off road workhorse, in the sense of each model can be bespoked with a face to face meeting; but in a real world engineering workshop not some SVO plush suite. I've never seen build availability so I don't know if there's a long waiting list or not. I think there are others on here who can speak of them in greater depth. Last edited by Supacat on 10th Dec 2020 5:48am. Edited 1 time in total |
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9th Dec 2020 6:52pm |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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Thanks Phil and Supacat. I did a lot of reading on them a couple of weeks back. Seems they would build what I would want for around £50,000.
I always seem to be waiting for companies to sort themselves out! We've been waiting for an age to change our business van to a plug-in hybrid. Still waiting. We are interested in handing over a shedload of cash to Ford for their little Courier van, but Ford are prepared to take their time. We may have to opt for the Renault Kangoo, instead. I and my business can't be alone in waiting to part with cash! Now left. |
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9th Dec 2020 6:56pm |
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| Bluest Member Since: 23 Apr 2016 Location: Lancashire Posts: 4206 
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Thanks, be interesting to check one out one day. It’s must be a bit of a risk building something based on a vehicle that is out of production and becoming a classic. There must come a point where good donors are difficult to find at reasonable cost. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS |
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9th Dec 2020 7:25pm |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3497 
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Ford have either been slow off the mark, or they have something in the pipeline. For such a large organisation, they don’t seem to be very proactive on any EV vehicles. I hope they have big plans and are waiting for others to venture forward before getting in too deep. |
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9th Dec 2020 7:42pm |
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| ChasingOurTrunks Member Since: 19 Aug 2020 Location: Canada Posts: 89 |
Totally get where you are coming from, but there are a few things that the Grenadier is likely to do much better than the Wrangler. I left my Wrangler behind -- I loved it, but I left it -- because of these gaps in capability. Depending on the kind of off-road you are doing, the Wrangler may not be suitable. They are fantastically capable vehicles, but they are seriously hurting both in payload and in the quality of the interior. Reliability/warranty service is also a problem I experienced (and many others), but Jeepers tend to turn their own wrenches so it's hard to really get a proper read on how reliable the Jeeps are. Some are excellent and bulletproof while others are almost worth mixing with a bit of soda water, because they are basically lemons. I know mine ate oil sensors for breakfast that required the top of the engine to come off yearly, and I went through quite a few bearings in the clutch prematurely. My jeep would also christmas-tree the dash to the point of being undriveable if there was a voltage problem in the battery (i.e. if the battery drained down too far). That being said, it always got me home -- and there was some very rough conditions that I used it in. 1300 lbs is the typical payload for the Jeep. If you go with a Rubicon, that's even less -- I only had 850 lbs to play with. For a solo or couple traveller, that's plenty. For anything more than that, it gets a bit tight (depending on other accessories). Bumpers, winches, etc. all eat into that payload significantly. Ineos is promising over a ton, so if you are doing family touring, you may find the Ineos fits your needs better. And in my opinion, the Wrangler interiors are not very nice. They aren't bad, but for a touring rig (my application), the interior has to be a "nice place to be". Wranglers are incredibly loud at highway speeds, and the solid-axled JK tended to wander a fair bit on the highway requiring constant corrections. I'm much more relaxed after a day driving my current rig than I was after a day driving the Rubicon that I owned. I'm told the JLs are better though. Still, the road noise was harsh -- if you enjoy things like conversations with your travelling partners, the road noise is enough to detract from that experience quite a bit in my opinion. Obviously this "is it a nice place to be?" question is unanswered for the Ineos though so this may not be a fair comparison. I miss my jeep, and I loved it...a lot actually, it was like a member of the family. But, there's a lot of romance with the Jeep -- as there is with the old Defender -- which washes over some of it's significant shortcomings as a vehicle in general. The Ineos has fixed the Payload issue, but is TBD on the interior and overall reliability/driving experience. |
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9th Dec 2020 8:03pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Curious to see article in press on this very matter, illustrated with this as some of the best options: Click image to enlarge Although the basis appears to be very much cost based "That is if EU-built vehicles were hit with a price hike by new import tariffs". https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/a...-year.html |
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10th Dec 2020 5:57am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Well it seems more people are finding reasons not to invest in Wales: 8,000 jobs to be created as £2.6bn electric car battery 'gigaplant' heads to Blyth. The project represents a huge vote of confidence in the area, having initially been destined to be built in South Wales. It emerged earlier this month that plans for it to be based in the Vale of Glamorgan had been ruled out. Once completed the huge 500m x 500m building will be the 16th biggest building in the world, and the fourth largest in the UK.
https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north...s-19435348 |
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11th Dec 2020 8:37am |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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That's great news for Wales (and Britain). We really have to start making stuff for the world to buy. Without getting too much off topic, me and the wife watched a YouTube video the other day about Britain in the 1960s (I was born in 1959). There are a series of these videos, and this one was about industry. Oh my god! Even I didn't realise how much we made. We were the largest bicycle manufacturers in the world! Our car industry was huge, and vital to Britain. Now, it only accounts for 0.8% of our GDP!
I'm still bitterly disappointed that Ineos is going to France, though, as I really did think billionaire Ratcliffe was interested in investing in Britain. I'm not going to make out I know too much about economics, but I don't understand how the figures stack up - it's going to save him some money (surely not a great amount) but the Made In France logo will lose him some buyers, surely? Similar with JLR. Making Defenders in Slovakia saves them a bit of money on wages, but again,surely not a fantastic amount? I was sad to hear that Morgan was sold to an Italian consortium after all these years, but I'm glad to see Westfield is still going strong, and proud to be British https://westfield-sportscars.co.uk Now left. |
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12th Dec 2020 8:50am |
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| DSC-off Member Since: 16 Oct 2014 Location: North East Posts: 1400 
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https://www.jaguarlandrovercareers.com/job...tartrow=60
Equivalent wages for manufacturing jobs in Slovakia are around half what the UK rate is. The above job, Eur 17.000 per yr is around £15,500. |
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12th Dec 2020 3:20pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Not even that for a job on the assembly line:
https://www.defender2.net/forum/post848870...tra#848870 |
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12th Dec 2020 4:53pm |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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I thought it was principally the £125 million that the Slovakian government gave JLR (widely reported at the time). Is that wrong? Now left.
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13th Dec 2020 1:56am |
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| Philip Member Since: 09 Mar 2018 Location: England Posts: 510
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Suggestion is that the French factory acquisition may be linked to INEOS taking a 1/3 stake in Mercedes F1.
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18th Dec 2020 10:48am |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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Philip, I find this odd. According to the motoring press, interest in F1 has been falling for a number of years. Why would Ineos want to get involved? Certainly, the future is going to be a move away from ICE to EV, so we may see some new names in F1, but Ineos isn't a maker of EVs or even battery drivetrains. Obviously they know far more about this than me, and it would be nice if someone in the know came on here to explain - I assume Ineos has a staff member reading this section.
I still think making the Grenadier abroad will cost them some sales. Even doing some rough calculations on 100 people or so a year deciding against the Grenadier (based on it not being 'British') still means a loss of £1,000,000 a year for Ineos. So I'm at a loss in understanding why they would want to tie in a French-making deal that makes them a third owner of an F1 team which is doing well, but which will surely be on the wane. Like I said, though, they are cleverer than me! Now left. |
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18th Dec 2020 6:22pm |
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