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Essexlandy



Member Since: 28 Mar 2016
Location: Essex
Posts: 8

United Kingdom 1986 Defender 110 200 Tdi HT Bronze Green
Here are some pics this is a 30 year old car remember.

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Post #561114 3rd Sep 2016 7:12pm
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HowieB



Member Since: 09 Jul 2016
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 11

United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 Landmark LE Corris Grey
Big thanks to Chris, aka Zagato.

Picked up my 90 on Sunday after having full treatment.
Excellent job done.
Highly recommend Chris's service, very helpful and wealth of knowledge.
Post #561999 6th Sep 2016 8:28pm
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Stacey007



Member Since: 25 Sep 2015
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 3751

United Kingdom 
Hello


I 'think' this is a job I would like to do rather than put it off...

I would like Zagato to do it, as looking at his work it's very good, he's also been very kind with some PM updates.

So I think I have found the kit I need.. there is someone local who uses waxoil (I Used this many years ago on mini's) quality of work did not look that brilliant to me though... I like the finish the Dinitrol gives.





Which includes this.


EXTRA LARGE CLASSIC RUSTPROOFING AEROSOL SPRAY KIT
Suitable for vehicles – MOTORHOME, LARGE VAN
Kit contains:
8 x DINITROL 3125 Cavity Wax 500ml Aerosol can
13 x DINITROL 4941 Black Underbody Wax 500ml Aerosol can
1 x Can Gun Trigger for Aerosol
1 x DINITROL RC900 Rust Converter Spray 400ml Aerosol can
2 x Extension Spray nozzle (600mm long) for Aerosol can
1 x Black Tapered Plastic Blanking Plugs 10mm (pack of 50)


then John Reeds of Rejel place this is coming from says he will swap the cans I need with in this to do a 110? not sure what that means.. The kit is around £140 for the bits (spray on)

I now have some ramps / axle stands but I do NOT intend to take more than 1 wheel at a time off...


Few questions.


I understand I need to removes as much mud and surface rust as possible from under the car, so Jetwash followed with wire brush?

Then I have to get it dry for 2 to 3 days.... (guess I cannot use the car if wet?)

Then start applying the stuff... can this be done by a non-professional (ie ME) in a day?


I'm looking at getting a boiler suit, masks, goggles and gloves... ooh and a cover for the drive (which is one reason to do it now as my car currently sits under a lean to and concrete base, but soon we are covering this with stone...so will hide any mess I make doing this job...)




Last question I will throw out there....


Anyone near Chester who would like to help for some beer much appreciated Smile



Thanks
Post #562436 8th Sep 2016 2:57pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2295

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Hello Stacy007

Your questions in order...

John at Rejel is probably saying he will swap into this kit what you ideally need to do a 110
(check exactly what you will get if so)

Standard (Large) Kit is...
8 x DINITROL 3125 Cavity Wax 500ml Aerosol can
13 x DINITROL 4941 Black Underbody Wax 500ml Aerosol can
1 x Can Gun Trigger for Aerosol
1 x DINITROL RC900 Rust Converter Spray 400ml Aerosol can
2 x Extension Spray nozzle (600mm long) for Aerosol can
1 x Black Tapered Plastic Blanking Plugs 10mm (pack of 50)

I used this for a 90...but went down the compressor route
not spray cans...
X2 RC 900 Rust Converter Aerosol Cans, with a Extension Wand
X2 Ltr ML Penetrating Fluid Schutz Cans
X4 Ltr 3125 HS Cavity Wax
X10 Ltr 4941 Surface Wax
1 Schutz Spay Gun with Extension wand
1 Ltr of fe-123 Rust Converter

Probably get more than you think... (when you're into this you don't want to run out) Embarassed
I wouldn't use the blanking plugs when done, as the Defender Chassis is designed to 'drain'
when water gets in...and therefore dry out

Jet wash...everywhere...everywhere...hours spent here will be worth it... Thumbs Up

I wouldn't use a wire brush (unless to remove / key some lose rust) if you are talking about getting dirt out then something much smaller will be required, if the jet wash doesn't remove it...a toothbrush even or a small 'scraper'...you will know when you do this, as the remaining 'stuff' is in corners and hard to get into small areas

Cleaning is a days job (IMO) even with what you think is a 'clean and tidy' Defender, that you have previously pointed the hose underneath... Exclamation

Let it dry out...totally...it takes what it takes...and yes no wet use... Sad

'Applied in a day by a none professional'...yes but I doubt you would want the result... Shocked

This timescale is only without removing anything (tread shows to an extent what is typically removed)
but if you go down the route of spraying a standard (nothing off) vehicle, one day by areosol is not enough (IMO)
to do a thorough job.

Obvious really 75% Preparation... 25% Execution (worth the effort though)

This is at least a whole weekends job...more if you 'strip' off stuff... Thumbs Up

Good Luck SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html
Post #562444 8th Sep 2016 3:51pm
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Scotm



Member Since: 28 Feb 2014
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 666

Scotland 2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Orkney Grey
If I was nearer I would happily give you a hand!

I have not used Dinatrol but Bilt Hamber and would suggest unless it is a nearly new chassis you will need to allow a couple of days to do it as you will need for any rust treatment to dry before applying the top coat.

If you can borrow ramps so you can get all 4 wheels up then you will get along much quicker as you can move around underneath a lot easier. If you are on concrete then a mechanics creeper would help even more.

Good luck with it and fingers crossed for a dry weekend.

To add to X4SKP's post - cleaning will take longer than you think - I use hose and jet wash and let it dry fully then clean with paint brushes using degreaser and then rinse again. I would suggest 2 or 3 attempts with drying each time is needed to get it clean.


Last edited by Scotm on 8th Sep 2016 4:05pm. Edited 1 time in total
Post #562447 8th Sep 2016 4:00pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20382

United Kingdom 
You might need to hoover out sections of your chassis, especially the large chassis holes in the rear arches.

Those two I taped over with duck tape, only those two as they are a mud trap.

Drying time, a warm day and dry 24hrs would be fine in my opinion.
Ideally 2 days if you can.
But I wouldn't say it was critical if you just wanted to go to a local shop. Just make sure it stays clean.

Time is running out for decent weather so I wouldn't hang about.

Thumbs Up
Post #562450 8th Sep 2016 4:04pm
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simon67



Member Since: 18 Jun 2015
Location: west sussex
Posts: 569

England 2004 Defender 90 Td5 HT Rutland Red
It was completed a few weeks ago, but just wanted to say thank you to Chris for a job well done
Also thanks for the kind words about the old girl
Post #562467 8th Sep 2016 4:53pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2295

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Scotm wrote:
If you can borrow ramps so you can get all 4 wheels up then you will get along much quicker as you can move around underneath a lot easier.



Click image to enlarge


First Gear... Low Range...Creep Up... Thumbs Up Good for general underside
(cover inner wheels with old 'sheets' to avoid over-spray)


Click image to enlarge


You still need to get each wheel off in turn, to tackle internal wheel arch areas...

Anticipate your timing (then double it... Exclamation )

No 1 Safety... Cool

Good Luck SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html
Post #562468 8th Sep 2016 4:59pm
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Stacey007



Member Since: 25 Sep 2015
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 3751

United Kingdom 
Thanks all,


I may have missed the boat weather wise?


I'm not sure I have enough time available (family man with two kids and School run / etc) to sort this before if anything the weather gets worse.


Will make a note of all what you need from those that have done it, maybe get all the stuff ready. I notice I may need more stuff than you get in the kit and as you say would rather have it than run out.


Thanks all, that 4 ramp set up looks handy, what are the covers on top of the ramps?
Post #562503 8th Sep 2016 7:29pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2295

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Hi Stacey007

A little additional woodwork to 'up' the standard metal ramps...
from re-purposed packing designed to hold large diameter pipes
so wheels 'step up' four positions to the top position and sit steady.
The Defender can then be wedged in place with a section of telegraph pole.

Actually the metal ramps have been 'adjusted' with extra metal straps
added to stop them 'splaying' and to engage them into the ground blocks...


Click image to enlarge



Click image to enlarge


bit of effort... but each time they come out... Mr. Green SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html
Post #562530 8th Sep 2016 8:02pm
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Hairysteve



Member Since: 15 Jun 2015
Location: Surrey
Posts: 692

United Kingdom 2009 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Barolo Black
Hey Skip I have spend a few more hours tonight cleaning those hard to reach areas in preparation for the 110 to be handed over to Zagato for treatment but am curious if you have used an air compressor to try and blow dirt out of those hard to reach areas?

Thanks,

Steve
Post #562534 8th Sep 2016 8:16pm
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Stacey007



Member Since: 25 Sep 2015
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 3751

United Kingdom 
Those ramps are Thumbs Up


As you say each time you use them it must make things much easier Smile


Think I will source all the stuff then see what chance I have of doing the job before winter
Post #562555 8th Sep 2016 8:56pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2295

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Hairysteve wrote:
Hey Skip I am curious if you have used an air compressor to try and blow dirt out of those hard to reach areas?


Hello Hairysteve

No... I used water, lots of it, a pressure washer with a fine jet to a fan shaped nozzle, and in some areas a degreaser (Gunk) and a salt removing product too, to flush the chassis also.

But if you do use a compressor make sure you wear eye protection... Exclamation

If it's off to Zagato immanently then probably best not to introduce too much water
unless it joins the 'line up' of vehicles waiting for the 'Z' treatment, and has time to dry out.

My 'experience' is on page 12 of this thread... mine took me 6 days all in, (I used it as a
kind on antidote from normal work), I wasn't in a rush, but it is a significant job to take on...

From what I have read on here, Zagato looks to be a very good option... Thumbs Up

Good Luck SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html
Post #562567 8th Sep 2016 9:19pm
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Numnuts



Member Since: 07 Sep 2016
Location: West Wickham
Posts: 6

United Kingdom 2005 Defender 90 2.5 TD XS CSW Santorini Black
Hi All,
Great forum, never thought I'd find rust so fascinating, however since acquiring a 10 year old 90, I'm now captivated.
Hoping for my first bit of advice. Car is relatively rust free appart from the corners of the rear cross member, where mud flaps are fixed. I can best describe as puff pastry.. Like the rust is causing the exterior to expand.
Since the rust is localised,I'm thinking(hoping) could the rust be stabilised then area filled. Just interested in your thoughts.



Click image to enlarge




Regards

Matt
Post #562599 8th Sep 2016 11:07pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2295

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Hello Numnuts

Rust... Shocked...some bed time reading... Exclamation

The basic approach is to:

Preparation...
1. Remove anything that is lose or will flake away as it is doing nothing in terms of providing strength / integrity to the base metal, it also allows water ingress back into the area. Review what's left...you look to be ok. Just (famous last words) remove the mud flaps, knock away anything lose, wire brush, sand down and generally clean up...(preparation / best to do when area is already dry)

Dry Out...
2. If wet leave to dry out...pinch wife / girlfriends / daughters hair dryer to help along (hot enough, beyond this / blow torch can cause wiring loom problems easily so avoid)

Convert Rust that Remains...
3. When dry, covert what's left with a good product, I use FE 123 (reviews really well)
http://www.rust.co.uk/fe-123-rust-converter/c28125/
The Rear Cross Member has a forward facing seam with intermittent welds, allowing water, crud, salt and anything else sent up from the rear wheels right into this area (not one of LR best arrangements) this area really is in the firing line. The cross member is 'this way round' to give a 'soft' radius on the outside face of the cross member (from the rear of the vehicle). This seam should be welded continuously, but isn't.

Dinitrol do a conversion product RC 900 and there is also a component of conversion in the Dinitrol ML product to nuturalize the Rust...I put the Dinitrol stuff generally over the top (in the areas that needed it) of the FE 123
as I really like how the FE 123 converter works.

Rust converters need some rust to work so the slight surface rust is OK it's the flaky rotten stuff you want to get rid of.

Paint / Protection...
4. Now stable, provide the protection of Dinitrol (other makes are available) 4941 outside 3125 HS inside areas (chassis / cross member cavity etc)

Personally I wouldn't 'fill' this seam (with anything other than a weld) as it will only work lose / cause problems down stream, really clean out well, convert what's left, and paint or seal well with a protective coating, maybe even the stone chip version of Dinitrol (or other)


Click image to enlarge


FE 123 (Converter) RC 900 (Converter) ML (Penetrating Fluid + Conversion) 1325 HS (Internal) 4941 (External)

Good Luck SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html


Last edited by X4SKP on 9th Sep 2016 11:30am. Edited 1 time in total
Post #562659 9th Sep 2016 9:05am
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