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Home > General & Technical (L663) > Worried about no rear lights visible with the tailgate open?
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90 Dreamer



Member Since: 13 Jul 2019
Location: Oop North
Posts: 2179
United Kingdom 2016 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 HT Corris Grey
Have come across lots of things which would fail the SVA / IVA process for kits cars or imports and yet are on mass produced vehicles
Post #851489 22nd Aug 2020 8:33pm
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mini Anaconda



Member Since: 23 Aug 2016
Location: Thames Valley
Posts: 798
United Kingdom 
Not sure how viable to achieve this would be on a new Defender, but here is a 'solution' hidden behind the spare wheel...


Click image to enlarge BORG - Bucks & Oxon 4x4 Response Group
Post #851492 22nd Aug 2020 8:58pm
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warren



Member Since: 14 Oct 2009
Location: East Lancs.
Posts: 903
England 2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Santorini Black
Could it have passed legislation with the thinnest tyre available for the Defender, thus leaving the lights visible from behind?

Or would it have needed to be tested with every tyre that's offered?
Post #851510 22nd Aug 2020 10:33pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018
United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Tim in Scotland wrote:

Strictly speaking it’s the same with any Defender/ pre-Defender model with a side opening rear door with a spare wheel mounted on it.


I don't think that is true.

Smaller OEM wheel, fixed directly to the door, with a less than 90 degree check strap will allow some of the light to be visible and therefore meet the requirements detailed.
Post #851522 23rd Aug 2020 7:13am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018
United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
blackwolf wrote:
It seems highly improbable that Landrover would be selling an illegal vehicle, or that Type Approval would have been forthcoming if it was illegal.


If the full manufacturer type approval contains a similar clause to that you provided for the IVA route, then it would appear that they have discharged their obligation?

"c. a notice in the vehicle must inform the user that in certain positions of the movable components, other road users should be warned of the presence of the vehicle on the road (e.g. by laying out a warning triangle)."

Putting it the other way, why would JLR place a triangle in the vehicle and a label on the door if there was no legal requirement to do so?

The real question for owners/drivers ~ are you committing an offence by opening your door when your lights are required and not deploying the triangle? The obligation to comply with the law rests entirely with you.
Post #851531 23rd Aug 2020 7:44am
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J77



Member Since: 04 Nov 2019
Location: Fife
Posts: 3425
Scotland 
Bit of a thread revival but came across this, seems like they’ve got it sussed



Click image to enlarge 24MY 90 D250 HSE, Tasman Blue
Post #880040 21st Jan 2021 11:15pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018
United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
It does appear to make more sense than the suggested JLR solution.

And going back to this:
blackwolf wrote:
It is extremely unlikely that a vehicle which is illegal by design would make it through EWVTA and into production, so I suspect that it is legal even if we cannot presently explain how.


There is a difference in the type approval regulations being applicable to the manufacturer; and the Lighting Regulations being applicable to the vehicle user.

There's enough latitude between the two to get the vehicle user into trouble.

Bentley had two recalls recently for it's bonnet mascot ~ one was to do with it being illuminated. It passed type approval but left owners in contravention of the Lighting Regulations.
Post #880054 22nd Jan 2021 7:33am
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LandRoverAnorak



Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11324
United Kingdom 
I like the new Defender - I even priced one up last week, much to my wife's amusement - but the rear lights baffle me. To me, they're a blatant case of over styling for what could and should be such a simple detail Confused Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia
Post #880061 22nd Jan 2021 8:05am
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LRSpain004



Member Since: 30 Jun 2020
Location: Elche
Posts: 68
Spain 
I agree completely with your comments, but when you have such a complete tool as the designer who says he is the soul of LR, then he was never going to place an elegant round light on the back IMO. No doubt he will c**K up the next vehicle also.
Post #880079 22nd Jan 2021 9:41am
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Sepp



Member Since: 05 Oct 2020
Location: Bavaria
Posts: 114
Germany 
Well, it's front view, but there always is room for design improvement. Rolling with laughter


Post #880102 22nd Jan 2021 11:02am
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SN



Member Since: 29 Jun 2007
Location: SK6
Posts: 729
^^^^ This post wins the internet today! Rolling with laughter Steve N | 21MY Defender | 08MY Discovery 3 (history) | 06MY Discovery 3 (ancient history)
Post #880117 22nd Jan 2021 11:57am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018
United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Not my photo:


Click image to enlarge

Someone was asking if JLR customisation would goes as far as the lunchbox...
Post #880136 22nd Jan 2021 12:58pm
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LRSpain004



Member Since: 30 Jun 2020
Location: Elche
Posts: 68
Spain 
Rolling with laughter
Sepp wrote:
Well, it's front view, but there always is room for design improvement. Rolling with laughter


Post #880159 22nd Jan 2021 4:24pm
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