 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > 2.4 tdci - BIODIESEL |
 
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| Scallops Member Since: 15 Aug 2007 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 89  
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I didn't say it won't run... it will - go ahead and do so - but what will happen over time is you will have problems - problems of your own creation. To generalise... The older the diesel engine (unless you get into unit injection like the TD5) the lower the injection pressure. Biodiesel fuels break down under extremes of heat and pressure and lose their lubricity. If your injectors are perfectly clean - then this isn't a problem, but if you get any "crud" in the injectors (and I'm talking crud with the dimensions of microns) then the loss of lubricity becomes a problem and the "crud" will deposit itself in the injector. Once it gets started it will attract more and more "crud" and eventually you get injector problems... Higher pressure injectors have finer internal tolerances than lower pressure injectors in an old school diesel like, a TDI, and the tolerances in the injectors are wide, combined with lower injection pressures, so for starters the fuel doesn't break down and any deposits won't clog the injector. In the Puma and other modern common rail injected diesel engines, the internal injector tolerances are much finer and the injection pressure is much greater than the cracking pressure of the fuel so you will get deposits... This is why the manual that came with your truck tells you in plain English - not to be run on biodiesel concentrations >5%. Just because someone is using biodiesel, with no apparent difference, in their Puma doesn't mean you should. The difference will become very apparent over time. |
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23rd Dec 2008 4:51am |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295  
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I'm with Russell -
I don't entirely disagree with what you're saying but it would appear we know have knowledge of Puma's doing 75k miles on 50/50 Bio and there's a chap over your way running a BMW 120d with common rail 3rd generation injectors running 100% Bio and again I believe with no problems to date (except when it was left out to freeze) ? At 15p / ltr I'm struggling to justify not using it...... |
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23rd Dec 2008 8:07am |
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| vogue se Member Since: 24 Jan 2008 Location: Bocholt Posts: 111  
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I don't want to spoil te fun but the manual of the Puma says : NO USAGE OF BIODIESEL ALLOWED.
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23rd Dec 2008 11:19am |
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| Eduardo Member Since: 28 Aug 2008 Location: Región Metropolitana Posts: 2109  
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Be carefully with Biodiesel.
In the short term, lets say 100,000 km you don't see any problem, but in the long term the different composition of the biodiesel could cause damages in the system that can reduce the motor lifetime. Cheers Eduardo MY 2007 110 SW PUMA 2.4: Big Fog of 64' MY 1994 Jayco 1207 Folding camper: "El Tremendo"  Click image to enlarge |
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23rd Dec 2008 11:35am |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295
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so can anyone confirm what the seals / o rings are made of ?
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26th Dec 2008 10:19pm |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295
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RonP
just wondering if you're not looking at the disco3 site - how are the forestry commission defenders getting on with the biodiesel? |
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6th Jul 2010 4:57am |
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| pom Member Since: 01 Jun 2010 Location: Worcester Posts: 1343 |
lots of crap talked about bioD
Using bioD actually cleans the engine. On a couple year old car you will have to change the fuel filters after a couple tanks of bioD as it flushes all the crap out of the system. As long as its been brewed correctly (read no meth left in it to eat rubber) there is no problem at all. Of course the manufacturer will not advise using it as shell / bp / esso and texeco dont sell 100% bio at the pumps which means your only option is homebrew and who's to say its good or bad. I don't blame them. But it has  all to do with bioD.
diesel is diesel. Pom |
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6th Jul 2010 12:58pm |
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| Mad Cow Member Since: 27 Oct 2009 Location: Hertfordshire Posts: 292 
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I believe the reason Land Rover state up to 5% is acceptable is because it is legal for fuel companies to put up to 5% bio in "ordinary" pump diesel without having to declare it and apparently this is common practice. MAD COW
2007 90 Hard Top - 2009 BMW F800GS - 2002 CCM 604E Dual Sport Project90 |
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6th Jul 2010 11:18pm |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295
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Mad Cow,
I believe as part of the save the planet policy we have to have at least 5% (mandatory) and this is proposed to increase to 7%. |
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7th Jul 2010 6:06am |
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| pom Member Since: 01 Jun 2010 Location: Worcester Posts: 1343 |
the save the planet scam, which i don't believe in by the way along with recycling and barking at the moon, is made worse by using bioD as it is extremely expensive in its raw state e.g. in the field. After the farmer has had his fat EU subsidy cheque for growing it, the chippy has sold a skipload of chips and endangered north sea cod from frying it in it. You get it third hand for 20% cheaper than natural environmentally friendly dino diesel (oops better not call it dino diesel as some of the religious minded get upset with their whole faith being disproved due to the fact dino's not mentioned in their made up bibles/quoran/beano etc). You then have to buy chemicals and use electricity to brew it. Have to do quite a lot of miles to make all this mundungus worthwhile.
They couldn't put more than 5% bio to normal diesel even if they wanted to unless we all start eating chips breakfast, dinner (thats right dinner is mid day hence dinner ladies at school)and tea as there simply is nowhere near enough. I'm up for giving it a go though!! So no conspiracy theory at all and nothing to do with legal. You can use 2000L of bio per year for personal use without incurring any duty charge amd having to register with HMCE. If anyone wants to build a processor I have loads of bits spare from where i dismantled mine after i stopped doing enough miles to make it worth it. Pom |
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7th Jul 2010 7:03am |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295
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pom
out of interest how many miles on (100%?) bio did you do in what cars - any problems? what sort of kit did you use? I used to use c35-50% bio in my puma till I got rid of it - didn't seem to make a blind bit of difference (it was running rubbish anyway - I believe as a result of carp getting into the fuel tank through the early tank breather set up). the new one will be running on c 30% too. my wifes citreon (110ps tdci engine as per focus) has now done c25k miles on 100%) no probs. |
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25th Jul 2010 6:18pm |
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| pom Member Since: 01 Jun 2010 Location: Worcester Posts: 1343 |
i used the graham lamming system. Brilliant setup.
Pom |
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25th Jul 2010 7:55pm |
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| harveyg77 Member Since: 09 Apr 2010 Location: Derby Posts: 309 
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Guys (Caterham and Pom),
Can you give me some pointers on the sort of 'systems' to use to brew my own biodiesel? I have a source for WVO at 30p/litre. How will a 1.9d Citroen Berlingo and a Transit 2.4 90ps cope with either straight WVO or a biodiesel mix? Thanks, Harvey |
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6th Sep 2010 7:31pm |
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| Caterham Member Since: 06 Nov 2008 Location: Birmingham Posts: 6295
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not sure about in the winter but I have a 1.9d berlingo at the moment and had to run it on straight wvo the other day and going back a few years used to run one on 50/50 wvo / derv.
re; the transit my suggestion would be start on a small percentage (say 20%) bio and work up to as much as you like. there's so many electronics and sensors these days I've known the odd vehicle not like the stuff - not sure why and to be honest it might not have been the fuel. I simply use a twin tank set up - one steel for heating the oil, the other stainless steel for mixing the chemicals. then just mix the two together thoroughly. leave to stand a few days slowly draining all the glycerol off. then bubble the bio to let the remaining methanol to evaporate off. then dry wash with eco2pur (kiln dried oak chippings). all good fun but please take care and don't under estimate the work involved - I did! |
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6th Sep 2010 8:49pm |
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