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diesel_jim

Member Since: 13 Oct 2008
Location: hiding
Posts: 6071

spudfan wrote:
From my home mechanical experience, regarding the female cup. Up to a certain "milage" things fall out of the cup, after that they seem to flow out. Seems milage and age affects the rigidity and suppleness of the structure. Ah the old days when everything was a snug fit.....

Where is this golden chalice you all speak of? Mine dissapeared on our wedding day

16th May 2024 7:47pm

ralsim

Member Since: 16 May 2024
Location: wales
Posts: 2

2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS DCPU Santorini Black

blackwolf wrote:
ralsim wrote:
2014
2.4 110 xs double cab
Original shaft until May 2024
Failed at 1580,000miles
LOF heavy duty will replace it

One-and-a-half MILLION miles ! I presume that is a typo?

Haha extra zero sneaked in there somehow current daily defender puma 110 xs 2.4
Current Project Series I 1.6 2 door
past
landrover 110 1983 v8 stage 3 engine with ported heads, ported polished inlet manifold balanced crank, large trumpets, top hat liners large valves ported plenum with large butterfly sadly stolen

17th May 2024 5:14am

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Keswick Green

ashtrans wrote:
Hi,

I thought I would chime in,

We have never had one of our design wear out to my knowledge,

Some customers with the earlier designs have had to change to outer collars due to oil leak issues but this was on the earlier designs, the later red collars have very few issues, the few that we have had usually have a reason for failure ie installation related, cross threaded or collar coming loose,

FYI as of today we have sold 4669 kits,

Dave

Hi Dave,

Being installed in June 2018, my "blue" Ashcroft spline fails due to oil leak issues (after 90 000 km).
So I am thinking about a replacement part.

I don't like the idea of fixing an Ashcroft kit every 90 000 km / 5 years.

For 4 years the kit has outperformed very well, so installation cannot be an issue (done by JLR reseller)

Are there any differences between the "blue" and the "red" splines (with respect to tightness) ?

Best regards

Julie

20th Jul 2024 9:47pm

Bluest

Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 4144

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

Had mine replaced yesterday, not for any reason other than the box was out for a clutch change and it seemed wise. However, on inspection, no signs of any wear on the old one to my eyes. You can still see the machining marks on the splines which suggests not much fretting at all.

2007 2.4 tdci 110, 97,000 miles. To my knowledge the shaft is original. It did have a clutch quite early in it's life, but nothing to indicate the shaft was done.

Click image to enlarge 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS

2nd Aug 2024 1:39pm

Ianh

Member Since: 17 Sep 2018
Location: Essex
Posts: 1907

With very limited wear and no grease to be seen ! you must have a very will aligned shaft

Petty all were not built like yours.

2nd Aug 2024 1:48pm

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

Red Ashcroft kit being installed yesterday replacing the blue one from 2018.
Design failure of the blue kit are quite obvious

3rd Aug 2024 8:42pm

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

Red Ashcroft kit being installed yesterday replacing the blue one from 2018.
Design failure of the blue kit are quite obvious

3rd Aug 2024 8:42pm

MK

Member Since: 28 Aug 2008
Location: Santiago
Posts: 2386

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Chawton White

Julie wrote:
Red Ashcroft kit being installed yesterday replacing the blue one from 2018.
Design failure of the blue kit are quite obvious

Can you explain the flaw of the blue one? Puma 110" SW

.............................................................
Earth first. Other planets later

3rd Aug 2024 10:32pm

DSC-off

Member Since: 16 Oct 2014
Location: North East
Posts: 1369

2015 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Aintree Green

Can you explain the flaw of the blue one?

My opinion, and I do not wish to negatively criticise Ashcroft in any way for the design evolution of their product.

Early pumas that failed did so at approximately say 50,000 miles on average.
Later vehicles that failed did so sooner at say approximately 30,000 miles on average.
This indicates that the alignment variability that causes the fail is worse in the later vehicles.
Julie's vehicle, 2012, is one of the later vehicles that has statistical been proven to be in the 'worse' category.

From page 9 of this thread showing failure rate for model years:

Click image to enlarge

Now consider the time that Ashcroft were first developing their coupling.
They were dealing with the earlier vehicles that had been in use for some time.
Later vehicles that were failing were still being fixed by LR under warranty and nobody outside JLR realised that the problem was getting worse.

So, in short, Landrover's quality problem got worse and the original Ashcroft design had to be modified to allow for that.

With the greatest respect.

4th Aug 2024 11:23am

BrickBox

Member Since: 05 Oct 2021
Location: Wales
Posts: 731

2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Zermatt Silver

LOF single piece above all IME. No extra splines to wear and no oil seals to leak. Fit and forget. 2008 2.4 110 Utility Station Wagon XS.

4th Aug 2024 11:33am

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

MK wrote:
]Can you explain the flaw of the blue one?

Have you ever seen plastic or rubber seals in engines or gearboxes ?

Just install your oïl sump using a rubber seal and see what happens after five years

4th Aug 2024 10:20pm

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

DSC-off wrote:

This indicates that the alignment variability that causes the fail is worse in the later vehicles.
Julie's vehicle, 2012, is one of the later vehicles that has statistical been proven to be in the 'worse' categorie..

Neither spline nor cone present any trace of wear

4th Aug 2024 10:28pm

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17192

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

BrickBox wrote:
LOF single piece above all IME. No extra splines to wear and no oil seals to leak. Fit and forget.

It will be interesting to see how these and similar rigid shafts perform long-term in vehicles with a proven appetite for standard couplings. I am not aware of anyone who has yet covered a significant mileage with a LOF shaft in a vehicle known to have an alignment problem, and I cannot quite avoid the fear that something more expensive than the original coupling will be wearing. I have no doubt at all that they will be fine in vehicles with well-aligned components, but there again so does the factory design in these cases.

Time will tell.

4th Aug 2024 10:28pm

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

These fabrication tolerances ("misalignement") are a forum legend - nobody ever measured and compared them.

Many design changes could influence corrosion :
- change of material (shaft or spline)
- grease
- tolerances
- temperature (the exhaust with DPF is hotter)
...

But tolerances do exist. They refused the installation of a rigid shaft (LOF, ...) - they install only Ashcroft and original ones. And it's one of the big five (independant Land Rover garages here in France )

5th Aug 2024 7:50am

Julie

Member Since: 07 Oct 2017
Location: Nantes
Posts: 436

5th Aug 2024 7:52am

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