Home > INEOS Grenadier > Main Grenadier discussion thread |
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spudfan Member Since: 10 Sep 2007 Location: Co Donegal Posts: 4636 |
That is not my opinion, I phrased it badly. I should have said
In certain people's eyes that does not make the New Land Cruiser a real Land Cruiser just like the New Defender is not a real Defender in certain people's eyes. 1982 88" 2.25 diesel 1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali 2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu 2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai |
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3rd Apr 2024 9:02pm |
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Zed Member Since: 07 Oct 2017 Location: In the woods Posts: 3244 |
The Land Cruiser doesn’t look like a branding exercise to me, it looks worthy of the name. Definitely a 4x4 and not a lifestyle SUV. WARNING. This post may contain sarcasm. |
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3rd Apr 2024 9:23pm |
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lightning Member Since: 23 Apr 2009 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2690 |
Ah okay I do agree that the Grenadier is more of a "classic" Defender than the new Defender. What a shame LR wouldn't sell the tooling for the old Defender to lneos. Then it would have been interesting to see what lneos came up with. |
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4th Apr 2024 8:50am |
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defender9 Member Since: 12 Mar 2016 Location: Fylde Coast Posts: 1629 |
Totally agree. I run a 27 year old Land Cruiser Colorado ( Prado) as a daily, it’s the light duty LC compared to the Amazon or the even more heavy duty 70 Series. I have had 2 new Defenders over the years and still have an old Series LR and a RRC but the LC has been faultless apart from the original starter motor playing up which I got repaired. I value reliability and vehicles which are well screwed together something unfortunately the Defenders did not have. I bought the LC just to see what they were like after selling my last Defender and given the LC was 20 years older than the Defender it was still better to drive and better screwed together. I’m really tempted by the new LC as long as it’s not overpriced but then again my old LC just does everything I need it to do. It gets serviced every year and is probably the only vehicle I have owned where I get into it and feel I could drive anywhere without issue. |
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4th Apr 2024 9:52am |
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Chicken Drumstick Member Since: 17 Aug 2020 Location: Near MK Posts: 707 |
Curious, but what creature comforts do you think the Grenadier is really lacking? I thought it seemed pretty well specced tbh. |
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4th Apr 2024 11:53am |
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Chicken Drumstick Member Since: 17 Aug 2020 Location: Near MK Posts: 707 |
What is your definition of a proper engine? Bear in mind while I personally love push rod V8's, they are not a mainstream engine in most world markets and most certainly not in Europe. Also not sure how it could be more rugged as a production vehicle. What isn't rugged enough for you? |
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4th Apr 2024 11:54am |
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Chicken Drumstick Member Since: 17 Aug 2020 Location: Near MK Posts: 707 |
I like the vehicle, but it is only a Defender in name. Design, features, function, market place, ability it is no more a "Defender" than a Range Rover is or even a Shogun. e.g. where is the chassis cab version, the pickup, the full tilt? I t doesn't even have flat wing tops or round headlights! Doesn't really matter if you own a new one or not. Everything you use your new Defender for a classic Range Rover, Disco 4, L494 RRS or even a 4th Gen Shogun could do. But there are many things the old Defender can do that you simply can't do with the new model. |
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4th Apr 2024 12:09pm |
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spudfan Member Since: 10 Sep 2007 Location: Co Donegal Posts: 4636 |
I do not think the Grenadier is biased as much towards on road use as a standard SUV that people seem to like. I have no issue with live beam axles as I drive a Defender. 1982 88" 2.25 diesel 1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali 2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu 2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai |
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4th Apr 2024 12:17pm |
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lightning Member Since: 23 Apr 2009 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2690 |
But presumably you can with a Grenadier? lf the Grenadier had been available in "Commercial" form for tax purposes l would have one on my drive. l had a Grenadier order for over 12 months but had to cancel as it wasn't a Commercial Vehicle in the eyes of HMRC. I wonder how the new Land Cruiser Commercial version will fare in this regard. If LR got the Defender Commercial classed as such by HMRC (despite the payload being under 1,000kg) then l am sure Toyota will be able to. I was in contact with lneos on this subject but the U.K. "Commercial" market was not a priority to them. They are concentrating more on "world markets" |
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4th Apr 2024 12:27pm |
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Ianb Member Since: 25 Oct 2023 Location: Devon Posts: 378 |
103 pages of discussion and still no general agreement across the board
Makes for interesting reading though. Definitely clear to see that people are approaching this from many different personal directions and that's dictating their final view on it all. The Yeti - 110 Camper https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic90308.html Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@YetitheDefender Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/yetithedefender/ |
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4th Apr 2024 3:47pm |
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spudfan Member Since: 10 Sep 2007 Location: Co Donegal Posts: 4636 |
If Land Rover had introduced this vehicle as it is now as a replacement for the Defender, how do you think it would have been received? 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali 2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu 2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai |
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4th Apr 2024 4:29pm |
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blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17310 |
Probably much the same as it has been. Those who bizarrely think the old Defender was an "SUV" would hate it, those who appreciated the old Defender for what is was would kind of like it but moan that it's too expensive, only has an auto box, doesn't leak enough, and of course it's not a proper engine because it has an ECU and the last proper engine was the 200TDi. |
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4th Apr 2024 4:39pm |
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Ianb Member Since: 25 Oct 2023 Location: Devon Posts: 378 |
I think it'd be met with a similar level of criticisms as the "Old D v New D".
I'm sure there is somewhere a Series vs everyone else crowd as well as a Defender vs Puma Defender... but likely less so than "old v new". I would say had LR released the Grenadier as the "new defender" there would certainly be a respectable amount of recognition on it's physical similarities, but I can only assume the gadgets and gizmos and the lack of manual transmission would garner dislike from purists. The Yeti - 110 Camper https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic90308.html Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@YetitheDefender Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/yetithedefender/ |
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4th Apr 2024 4:46pm |
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Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3479 |
Nicely put blackwolf. I think you have summed it up rather nicely
I don't think Land Rover stood a chance. The new vehicle was never going to be everything to everyone. Land Rover as a company were moving (or let's be honest, had moved) their cars to the 'luxury' end of the market. Whatever they produced was not going to be an 'old Defender' style vehicle (some may say, thank God!) An Ineos Grenadier or Toyota Land Cruiser vehicle, if produced to replace the Defender would still have managed "103 pages of discussion and still no general arrangement across the board" to steal Ianb's words What I would say in Land Rover's defence, they have produced a very popular vehicle which is selling very well. It has been said on here many many times, maybe they would have been better killing off the name and calling their new vehicle a Discovery? |
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4th Apr 2024 4:52pm |
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