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Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Zermatt Silver

Brake issue

Evening,

I had the common issue where the brake vacuum pump spits all its oil out, so I replaced the vacuum pump and then had an issue where if I use the brake on off in quick concession then pedal would just harden up and brakes not work.

I put this down to a fault pump due to not happening before the oil leak.

I have since put a second pump on and noticed when I took it off there seemed to be minimal oil in and around the pump. Now the second one is clicking away as if it’s running dry.

What would stop the oil getting to the vacuum pump. Is it engine oil or brake oil and does it have a seperate tank?

Does it need bleeding?

TIA!

13th Nov 2021 10:27pm

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17372

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

If it is a 2.4 (which from your description I suspect it is) the vac pump is fed from the engine lubrication system and has feed and return passages through the mounting surface. The only reason why it would not be getting the oil feed would be if the gasket has been fitted incorrectly or if an oil passage is blocked.

The hard pedal fault you describe suggests that the pump is not creating vacuum fast enough and does suggest either that the pump was faulty or possibly there was a leak in the vacuum pipe after you refitted it.

There should be no brake fluid anywhere near the vac pump, only engine oil, and as noted above it is fed form the engine's pressurised lubrication system and needs no bleeding.

13th Nov 2021 11:03pm

MadTom

Member Since: 10 Sep 2013
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 617

Check for vacuum leakage. I had to replace brake servo on two cars, because it had broken outer steel body and was loosing vacuum. It was only slow leak, first breaking was normal, but repeating breaking leaded to hard pedal. "Drobek" = The Small One - Discovery 2, "Blufínek" = The Blue Thing - Defender 130, and for me at least Ford Mondeo

14th Nov 2021 6:25am

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Thanks for the info,

I believe it’s something to do with oil to the pump as the brakes were fine it’s only if you use them in quick concession as if you were doing a 5 point turn for example.

The other tell tale is that it is ticking quite loudly. If I was to take the pump off and start the engine I’m assuming there will be a ton of oil pour out one of the holes?

Trying to think of a way to test it.

14th Nov 2021 9:10am

Dinnu

Member Since: 24 Dec 2019
Location: Lija
Posts: 3414

2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Santorini Black

Ensure that the vacuum pipe between the pump and the servo is not collapsing, restricting the air flow rate. 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing
2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black

14th Nov 2021 10:57am

landy andy

Member Since: 15 Feb 2009
Location: Ware, Herts
Posts: 5695

2006 Defender 110 Td5 USW Zermatt Silver

Have you checked the servo is empty, and not full of oil? You can use a cable tie as a dipstick.

14th Nov 2021 11:29am

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Sounds interesting how would I do this? Where would I dip it?

14th Nov 2021 2:39pm

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Dinnu wrote:
Ensure that the vacuum pipe between the pump and the servo is not collapsing, restricting the air flow rate.

This is next on my list!

14th Nov 2021 2:39pm

Race.it

Member Since: 27 Aug 2019
Location: Algeciras
Posts: 817

2010 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Alaska White

Silver110 wrote:
Sounds interesting how would I do this? Where would I dip it?

Take off the vacuum pipe on the servo and use that hole? Searching for my first Defender...and started just as Covid hit, so talk about timing.

5 months after starting the search I found it, and here is the details

14th Nov 2021 5:05pm

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Servo is empty of liquid and can’t see any issue with the vac pipe. Took it off the servo and put the vac onto my finger and had suction.

I’ve also recently installed the LOF power spec discs and pads
But don’t see that being an issue.

Have searched through hole car whilst on ramp and can’t seen any leaks.

21st Nov 2021 7:09pm

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Does anyone know anything about bleeding the ABS system? Thinking it may be linked to that.

23rd Nov 2021 6:49pm

Bluest

Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 4209

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

There’s a procedure in the workshop manual for power bleeding the pump and brakes. You need a diagnostic tool that can actuate the ABS pump. I did it last year after removing and refitting the pump. I pressure bled the brakes conventionally before following the manual to power bleed. To be honest, I couldn’t get any more air out power bleeding, so I think it can be done the old fashioned way. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS

23rd Nov 2021 7:15pm

Silver110

Member Since: 10 Jun 2020
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 49

Thank you.

Back to the drawing board, frustrating.

24th Nov 2021 9:02pm

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