 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Starter motor problem developing? |
 
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| shropshiredefender Member Since: 05 Jun 2017 Location: Shropshire Posts: 834   
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Started the 2011 2.4 110 XS Utility as usual (instantly on turning the key) this morning. Ran normaly for 40 miles or so, stopped for no more than 5 mins. Restart sounded like a dead battery and caught on second turn of the key, but only just. Drove for another 100 miles. 3 stops of 3 - 40 mins. and started normaly.
Had battery drop tested and it is in good condition. Could this be the begining of a starter motor issue? - Or something else?  |
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1st Sep 2017 2:26pm |
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| X4SKP Member Since: 29 Nov 2013 Location: Berkshire Posts: 2295  
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Hello shropshiredefender
I had similar symptoms early this year and chased the 'issue' (spending money where it needn't have been spent...  )
I also have a 2.4 (late 2010 MY2011) It may well be your Starter Motor... How many miles...  ...not an accurate indication of SM condition but a start
Before you start replacing anything significant... Check all your connections...(everyone in the Starting Circuit) easy said, but when you actually come to do this it really takes time... All Power Feeds High and Low Voltage and All Earths. Check the Starter Motor Relay... (replacing this is next to no money so do this if you want and carry the old one as a spare). No 3 is the Starter Relay...  Click image to enlarge After hours of work I traced my issue to the physical connection of the Red White Wire on the back of the Ignition Switch...which feeds Power back to the Starter Relay, you can hear this Relay 'click over' when working correctly (even with the seat in place) I then know she will start. Starter Relay (R102)... Click image to enlarge Through to Starter Motor... Click image to enlarge Would be amazing if your issue was the same as mine, but really check the Ignition Switch connections are good...I cleaned the brass blade with 1000 wet and dry stuck to a needle file, tightened the push on connector added 1 drop of WD40 and reattached (with a more positive click into position)...all is now good. Click image to enlarge My suspicion is as the blade and connector are dissimilar metals there may be some surface 'electrical corrosion' / or 'scaling' going on, probably on the Brass Blade of the Ignition Switch, anyway 100% this was my issue. I finally sorted this after at times seeing (and testing) Red... Click image to enlarge Good Luck...  SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html |
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1st Sep 2017 3:16pm |
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| shropshiredefender Member Since: 05 Jun 2017 Location: Shropshire Posts: 834
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Thanks chaps - checking all those items will keep me busy for the weekend!
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1st Sep 2017 3:27pm |
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| shropshiredefender Member Since: 05 Jun 2017 Location: Shropshire Posts: 834
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Its done 100.000 miles. The ignition switch was replaced last Jan. so I'll check that first!
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1st Sep 2017 3:33pm |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20350
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^^^^ Probably something mixed up with that as already suggested.
$W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐ฌ๐ง๐ด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐ด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐ด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐ฎ๐ช๐บ๐ธโฝ๏ธ๐ข๏ธโ๏ธ๐งฐ๐ช |
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1st Sep 2017 6:09pm |
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| Lightningtweeds Member Since: 16 May 2017 Location: Fintry Posts: 461  
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Just change the starter they are overworked and clog up with clutch dust. Signs are intermittent dead starter which will leave you stranded. You have had a longer life than most.
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2nd Sep 2017 6:30am |
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| ian series 1 Member Since: 17 Nov 2014 Location: south Posts: 3127 
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Mine was doing the same, always started from cold, as soon as the engine was warm it would give symptoms of a flat battery, but would always start.
(It's a classic symptom) As said above, the starters that are fitted to the Defender TDCI along with Peugeots, Fords etc are not the greatest starters in the world, and they do suffer with dust contamination badly. If your going to replace it, get a decent Bosh unit. 80" 80" 86" 88" 90" Wanted, Forward Control Anything considered. |
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2nd Sep 2017 7:56am |
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| shropshiredefender Member Since: 05 Jun 2017 Location: Shropshire Posts: 834
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Thanks everyone.
I spent Saturday tracing and cleaning connectionsand earth points, re seating and changing relays, and tightening the battery earth connection roughly 1/4 turn. Could not replicate fault in around 20 starts, hot and cold. However I will replace the starter motor before my next continental trip (with a Bosch unit). The original starter will be stripped cleaned and used as a spare. At least I know that if / when it happens again all is OK up to the starter. |
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3rd Sep 2017 8:54am |
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| zeroland Member Since: 18 Jan 2017 Location: Sydney Posts: 3  
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Good timing on this post. Similar symptoms on my 110 however I find that the electronics seem to loose power as the starter motor engages and fails to start the motor. As a result, the trip meter resets to zero and my radio resets.
Got the local battery centre to test the battery and they claim it's still good. Based on the above, could it be a simple fix like tightening up the earth or the starter motor is on the way out? |
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4th Sep 2017 4:38am |
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| shropshiredefender Member Since: 05 Jun 2017 Location: Shropshire Posts: 834
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The starter is drawing too much current from the battery hence everythig else cuts out.
With luck it's a bad earth connection. So check battery earth, earth connections on transfer box and starter as suggested above. I gave then all a good cleaning and tightening as well, wire brush and WD40. Even if the earths are OK you will have done good preventative maintenance, as I should have done! 
Be lucky |
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4th Sep 2017 3:56pm |
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| dilukabey Member Since: 17 May 2011 Location: Sri Lanka Posts: 173 
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I had the similar issue with starter motor. Found the starter motor was dry with worn brushes. I replaced the brush kit and lubricated well with grease and all went right since then!
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5th Sep 2017 4:34pm |
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| zeroland Member Since: 18 Jan 2017 Location: Sydney Posts: 3
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Thanks for the suggestions. Gave the earth connections a good clean and then plugged in the iCarSoft scanner to check if any symptoms were being logged. I did notice error P068A (Engine control module - power relay de-energised too early) was logged and after a bit of research people claimed starting issues when an ODBII device was permanently connected. I have an UltraGuage connected.
Since disconnecting the UltraGuage and cleaning the earth wires, no starter motor gremlins! BTW, when the iCarSoft ODBII was connected and I started the engine, I got the Battery light and no movement in the rev needle. |
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8th Sep 2017 4:45am |
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| X4SKP Member Since: 29 Nov 2013 Location: Berkshire Posts: 2295
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Interesting...  can anyone add anything here...
Whilst 'chasing' my intermittent starting problem, I did a 'back to basics' electrical set up and test...various things providing security / monitoring were disconnected. I also disconnect my ScanGaugeII which is otherwise permanently connected, I never thought that this may be an issue, and am convinced that it wasn't in my case, but I have never heard that it might be. There is some comment (on-line) that the initial start up procedure with a Puma Defender can be 'interfered' with during the 'glow plug warm up stage' (until the light goes off), by doing something like operating the heater / fan / AC or as with a D2N member on here, the electric windows. My Radio / CD / Sat Nav begins to come on before start up (second stage ignition) so I was aware of this also...disconnection and testing made no difference for me. Maybe this 'electrical noise' (if that's the correct term) of some devices, could potentially cause a starting issues for some... I'm 6 months and 6K miles post issue now with no problems (SGII connected throughout) Click image to enlarge SKIP https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html |
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8th Sep 2017 8:48am |
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