 | Home > Td5 > Excessive black smoke |
 
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| LandRoversofLondon Member Since: 07 Jul 2016 Location: London Posts: 22  
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In recent weeks my 2005 Td5 has started producing excessive amounts of black smoke under acceleration and when in 5th on the motorway, to the point where I've been pulled over by the police.
I've had it remapped but been told that's not the issue. The boost hoses are fine and the injector readings are normal. The intercooler is not leaking and the turbo has been replaced recently. I am unsure as to what could be causing the smoke, could anyone suggest any possible issues? I don't particularly fancy spending a lot of money on repairing an engine that is not ULEZ compliant come October 2021, would it be worth just exploring engine conversions? Instagram @LandRoversofLondon www.instagram.com/landroversoflondon |
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9th Sep 2020 4:12pm |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2237 
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Is the EGR still fitted? 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread
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9th Sep 2020 4:28pm |
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| LandRoversofLondon Member Since: 07 Jul 2016 Location: London Posts: 22
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No. It’s had an EGR delete
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9th Sep 2020 4:31pm |
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| roel Member Since: 08 Aug 2009 Location: Lelystad Posts: 2039  
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Do you have a nanocom or silmilar?
Does it feel like you lost power? The ECU is not suddenly giving more fuel so it has to be the air side. You said the hoses are OK but did you look at the inside? On my CT 300 TDI I had an intenal part off the hose coming loose and partly blocking the air. Did you check your airfilter? Is the wastegate stuck open? Roel 1984 90 2.5 na Diesel - RR V8 (1994-2001) 1997 Camel Trophy Discovery 300TDI (2001-2009) 2005 G4 Discovery III 4.4 V8 (2008-2018) It's gone but it still hurts. 2003 90 Td5 (2009-now) |
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9th Sep 2020 5:23pm |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2237
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Have you got a snorkel/RAI and driven in the rain lately? If so could be that your air filter has got wet and broken down.
Steve 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread |
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10th Sep 2020 4:48pm |
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| mk1collector Member Since: 17 Sep 2009 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 6769  
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Try unplugging the MAF Ray
My build thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic17615.html |
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10th Sep 2020 6:33pm |
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| achuakh Member Since: 12 Apr 2012 Location: Singapore Posts: 158  
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the ECU will give you the fuel amount based on the amount of air it measures in a nutshell.
Unless the relationship of the air to fuel look up is messed up from the remap, then it will do this. meaning, if i simply adjusted the injector PWM timings then this is very likely to happen. simple example here (which is not taken from any real world table on the Td5 map), i have 500mg/stroke of air coming in at Y rpm, i look up the table and it say 35mg of fuel to be injected to give 14.28:1 ratio, however in the next lookup for 35mg of fuel from the injector timings, i increase the PWM control timing of the injector by 25%. the ECU doesn't know this is happening, as it's the last point where it fires off the injector based on that timing and assumes 35mg of fuel was injected, but (assuming it's linear), it's now 43.75mg being injected which gives a 11.42 ratio, this will result in black smoke for the amount of air in the cylinder. This is how most "power boost boxes" do their tuning by increasing the PWM of the injector with no respect to the air flow. or the other possibility, assuming it's not done this before and recently it started do this is that your injectors are worn and you will need to change them, the logic here is that as the injectors wear out, the spray patten is not as fine, so the surface area of the fuel which contact the air in the cylinder is lesser. however before you go down this route, check that you have good injector washers/seals. assuming it's an EU3 motor (15p) then the ECU uses the MAF, so you need that to measure correctly. if performance is restricted, then disconnecting this sensor makes the ECU use "default airflow values" based on the RPM of the engine to run the fuelling. do note that it's slightly more aggressive and there will be some black smoke. load the default map for your vehicle back on the ECU to verify if it's still smoking, if it stops, it's more likely the first case when the PWM was adjusted incorrectly. this just points to too much fuel with insufficient air to burn it all up as diesels need to run a tad lean to not product black smoke. you can see all these black smoking issues when you have a straight thru exhaust. if you still have a cat stuffed in there, it can help hide it for awhile. if you have access to diagnostics, like a nanocom, you can log the drive with the value from the ECU to know how much air your are getting and then work out how much is going into each cylinder (again we assuming it's divided equally into 5 when your timing is spot on), then work out your air to fuel ratio based on your injector tables. this requires you to know more about how to pull the map from your ECU and read it. DISCLAIMER: I am NOT a profession tuner and i'm just having fun with my own Td5. hence, there will be things that i do not know or might be incorrect and the stuff that I've mentioned above is from my own experience and knowledge floating around on the internet. From the land of the most expensive land rover defenders on planet earth. At �125k for a XS 110 csw and you get to own it only for 10yrs! Please find me a good reason to stay on this island. |
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14th Sep 2020 2:09pm |
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| LandRoversofLondon Member Since: 07 Jul 2016 Location: London Posts: 22
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I haven't got a nanocom. Yes, it almost feels as if the turbo is lagging. i've had it remaped, upgraded intercooler, new radiator and new turbo but it still feels sluggish on occasions. I'll have a look at the hoses and air filter this evening. Instagram @LandRoversofLondon www.instagram.com/landroversoflondon |
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24th Sep 2020 12:01pm |
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| excossack Member Since: 22 Feb 2012 Location: North West Posts: 5850 
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I to am having black smoke issues. So far I have put this down to lack of use.
But checked the airfilter and not too bad. Not excessive/over dirty. Checked MAF and at 55 I think at idle. Started checking the hoses last night. So far OK. Planning a good run tomorrow to Donnington circuit and will put a bottle of Wynns through the tank 1999 Defender TD5 110 Regards John M0VAZ Econet Station 48 no clock |
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24th Sep 2020 1:45pm |
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| AT1963 Member Since: 08 Jul 2020 Location: Leicestershire Posts: 148 
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Mine smokes (dirty habit!!) and at one point i thought it might fail MOT however it didn't.
Cleaned the MAP sensor and MAF. Changed air filter and it still smokes but is better. I do drive it hard though and engine is responsive for it  |
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24th Sep 2020 6:32pm |
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| Chris86 Member Since: 15 Jul 2014 Location: South Yorks Posts: 789 
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Mine was being very smoky after nearly 4 months of doing nothing.
Ran a tank of premium diesel through it and gave it a bit of the 'Italian tune up' and it has now settled. Regards Chris |
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24th Sep 2020 7:14pm |
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| derbywill Member Since: 25 Mar 2010 Location: Derbyshire Posts: 559 
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Give the MAP and MAF a clean, if it hasnt had a MAF in a while it may be worth replacing it (Siemens/Continental only).
I also find Td5's require some injector cleaner every now and again, I notice mine is getting a little smokey use a tin of Forte injector cleaner and its alot better. Cheers Will 2005 90 XS 1954 86'' Series 1 tilt 1968 88” 2A 200tdi 2002 110 Hardtop |
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25th Sep 2020 11:11am |
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| excossack Member Since: 22 Feb 2012 Location: North West Posts: 5850
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Just chucked a bottle of Wynns Injector cleaner in mine and then topped off the tank.
I stood pondering how one bottle of Wynns would clean the turbo, while another bottle will do injectors.....? 1999 Defender TD5 110 Regards John M0VAZ Econet Station 48 no clock |
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25th Sep 2020 11:25am |
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| roel Member Since: 08 Aug 2009 Location: Lelystad Posts: 2039
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The bottle for the turbo should no go in the diesel tank, I believe.
 Roel
1984 90 2.5 na Diesel - RR V8 (1994-2001) 1997 Camel Trophy Discovery 300TDI (2001-2009) 2005 G4 Discovery III 4.4 V8 (2008-2018) It's gone but it still hurts. 2003 90 Td5 (2009-now) |
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25th Sep 2020 5:33pm |
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