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Rashers

Member Since: 21 Jun 2015
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 3498

2014 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 USW Corris Grey

90 Dreamer wrote:
but if the fire can't spread then a stay put policy does work............

have read there are numerous problems with trying to retrofit any form of reliable fire suppression system

Yes and yes!

As described earlier, power requirements are an issue, water supply is an issue, water storage size and location can be a problem. Also trying to find space to put pipework for the sprinklers (limited head height in communal areas) and space for the pumps and plant.

There is also the problem of vandalism and the damage caused if the sprinkler goes off unintentionally.

Most of these high rise buildings don't even have fire alarms and those that do are often ignored when they go off as 99% of the time they are false alarms and people get complacent.

In reply to Pilgrimmick, there lies the problem with Sprinklers. Anything life safety is expensive. You have found the reason why building owners will do nearly anything rather than fit a sprinkler system into their buildings. And once fitted, they need maintaining which is more cost that a landlord doesn't want.

5th Sep 2020 9:29am

LandRoverAnorak

Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11324

I once had to deal with a secondary school that had decided that a series of fire doors along a corridor were a nuisance as the kids thundered through them every break time. Their solution was to remove them all and burn them

Needless to say that they were replaced, at great expense, and fitted with hold-open devices but you can't underestimate 'stupid'. Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia

5th Sep 2020 10:49am

AndrewS

Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Hereford
Posts: 3707

2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red

Quite a few schools in England do have sprinklers. We are simply trying to get the powers that be to talk. 130's have feeling's as well you know

5th Sep 2020 12:34pm

zippo87

Member Since: 29 Mar 2019
Location: Moray
Posts: 100

1996 Defender 110 300 Tdi CSW Epsom Green

We have recently had a foam suppression system dropped as part of an integrated building design due to its sensitivity and failure rates - tbe replacement being a host of moveable/deployable turrets. Either way the damage will run into millions despite whether the assets get burnt down or foamed up - But safety of personnel is paramount and unquestionable.

6th Sep 2020 8:44am

Likeomg

Member Since: 29 Jun 2012
Location: Lake District / Newcastle
Posts: 2640

2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Stornoway Grey

Working on a ship we have a ridiculous safety culture. Can’t believe dry land hasn’t caught up..

Is it actual drencher systems or hifog? We have a officer training course which compares a drencher and hifog crazy difference.

6th Sep 2020 1:22pm

LandRoverAnorak

Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11324

Caught up with what? It's a completely different risk. It's a lot less straightforward to leave a burning ship than a burning building. Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia

6th Sep 2020 4:44pm

Rashers

Member Since: 21 Jun 2015
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 3498

It's also probably got a lot to do with the insurers requirements on a ship, I am guessing?

Total loss of a ship, it's cargo and then possible salvage (if it is salvagable) would be a pretty penny.

Possibly a lot more than re-construction of a building.

6th Sep 2020 5:00pm

Likeomg

Member Since: 29 Jun 2012
Location: Lake District / Newcastle
Posts: 2640

I agree, not really anywhere to go from a ship but schools are full of young kids... caught up
With our fire detection, and suppression systems.

Knowing what technology is available from working at sea, compare it to
My college I studied at (within last few years) it has nothing in comparison

And insurers only make up a small part, we have imo, class society’s, p&i clubs all fighting for better safety, guess it’s just a money thing

6th Sep 2020 9:02pm

LandRoverAnorak

Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11324

As I said earlier though, schools full of young kids are a very controlled environment and incredibly safe. It really is a very different risk profile. Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia

6th Sep 2020 9:20pm

AndrewS

Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Hereford
Posts: 3707

LandRoverAnorak wrote:
Caught up with what? It's a completely different risk. It's a lot less straightforward to leave a burning ship than a burning building.

Or a building thats not burning

130's have feeling's as well you know

6th Sep 2020 9:44pm

andydef90

Member Since: 09 Feb 2015
Location: yorkshire
Posts: 617

2014 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 HT Corris Grey

at the school i work at we had a new build a few years ago when in asked about sprinklers the reply was the systems are expensive to install and they do more damage than a fire would . we have fire and smoke detectors in every room and the burglar alarm actually will set the alarm off with heat and movement . of course been the caretaker and general dogs body i am the mug who is expected to sort it out id have sprinklers in a heart beat

8th Sep 2020 1:03pm

LandRoverAnorak

Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11324

You'd still have all of that kit though, Andy. Sprinklers would be in addition to rather than instead of. Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia

8th Sep 2020 1:14pm

Projectblue

Member Since: 22 Nov 2011
Location: Devon
Posts: 1096

Re: Life safety Fire Sprinkler systems in schools

AndrewS wrote:
As some of you know I am involved in Fire Sprinkler Systems in that my company refurbishes the water tanks that hold the water that puts the fire out.
Our industry is pushing the government to update Building Bulletin 100 to make it mandatory that fire sprinklers are fitted in all new build and majorly refurbished schools in England. Scotland and Wales already have this in place.

If you could sign this petition perhaps we could persuade the powers that be to get sprinklers in to English schools.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/549558

Apologies that this is coming in a negative stance but have I understood this correctly that a Company that is involved in making profit* from the fitting/refurbishing of sprinkler systems is petitioning the Government to fit sprinklers in to all schools?

Is there any data to illustrate the danger to life in schools over say, last ten years?

*appreciate that business will be tendered and there is no guarantee of it going to connected to Company. New project and it's green: www.projectoverland.info

8th Sep 2020 8:18pm

andydef90

Member Since: 09 Feb 2015
Location: yorkshire
Posts: 617

hi project blue I fully understand your comment we have some who take advantage of our school the days of having huge budgets have gone it now filters down from the top . I would hate to think what would happen during the school day if there was a large fire . the last one here was arson witch tends to be common more this time of year usually by a student not wanting to return to school in new builds I think sprinklers have there place and major refurbish schools it should be considered . ultimately though its always the same THE COST

10th Sep 2020 6:13am

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