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dgardel

Member Since: 30 Nov 2008
Location: Veneto (Heart & Head)
Posts: 3586

ROBBONTHEROCK wrote:
.........

I found on the web a denso training manual which goes into deep discussion on the Denso HP3 system, which is what is on a 2.4ltr duratorq.

..........

Link? Discovery 5 td6 HSE Stornoway Gray Outback Engineering Limited Edition

IID Pro MV License

14th Jul 2017 12:33pm

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Alpine White

how long can one run a faulty VCV, and are there any long-term issues?

reason I'm asking is that my indie can only attend to my Puma in August, so still 3 more weeks to go

--
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

14th Jul 2017 12:55pm

ROBBONTHEROCK

Member Since: 23 Jun 2014
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 637

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Firenze Red

dgardel wrote:
ROBBONTHEROCK wrote:
.........

I found on the web a denso training manual which goes into deep discussion on the Denso HP3 system, which is what is on a 2.4ltr duratorq.

..........

Link?

http://steldiesel.ru/files/crdensoservismanual.pdf

http://www.yildiz.edu.tr/~sandalci/dersnotu/AKTraining.pdf

Note the pump on denso website refers to HP3

Click image to enlarge

Worth a read, my diesel engine knowledge is based on 90's plant engines, so relatively unsophisticated. The common rail system is fascinating.

I originally set-out to understand if the SCV or VCV was effectively an electronic throttle, but its not that at all.

All it does it removes parasitic loads on the engine by reducing load on the injection pump when full fuel is not required. I.e. don't waste energy heating and working fluid that is essentially unused.

brilliant stuff

Cheers
Andy

14th Jul 2017 5:55pm

churchy

Member Since: 28 Jul 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 237

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

Thanks Andy - I too hVe a roadtrip to Europe coming up so need to get the issue sorted before setting off.

Would a faulty vcv be causing the egr to be noisier and cycle more on road and when when switching the engine off?

16th Jul 2017 5:45pm

ROBBONTHEROCK

Member Since: 23 Jun 2014
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 637

Hi,

I'm really not sure. I would ask one of the forum experts, who work on these for a living.

But from my understanding, the VCV being faulty shouldn't cause the erg to fail, and vice versa

But it seems the erg and the vcv seem to have similar lifetime's.

I suspect failure on either (seals passing on EGR) would not help and with both weak at the same time it would probably feed off each other.

Cheers
Andy

PS for what its worth, I'm getting vcv and erg done at same time.

16th Jul 2017 10:17pm

dgardel

Member Since: 30 Nov 2008
Location: Veneto (Heart & Head)
Posts: 3586

ROBBONTHEROCK wrote:
dgardel wrote:
ROBBONTHEROCK wrote:
.........

I found on the web a denso training manual which goes into deep discussion on the Denso HP3 system, which is what is on a 2.4ltr duratorq.

..........

Link?

brilliant stuff

Cheers
Andy

Thank you Andy Discovery 5 td6 HSE Stornoway Gray Outback Engineering Limited Edition

IID Pro MV License

17th Jul 2017 3:57am

dgardel

Member Since: 30 Nov 2008
Location: Veneto (Heart & Head)
Posts: 3586

Naks wrote:
how long can one run a faulty VCV, and are there any long-term issues?

reason I'm asking is that my indie can only attend to my Puma in August, so still 3 more weeks to go

No, but the engine can be a bit more noisy. I run 2 years without PCV learning procedure successful. After PCV changed, I was able to run the procedure without any issue

churchy wrote:
Thanks Andy - I too hVe a roadtrip to Europe coming up so need to get the issue sorted before setting off.

Would a faulty vcv be causing the egr to be noisier and cycle more on road and when when switching the engine off?

No relationship between the EGR and PCV Discovery 5 td6 HSE Stornoway Gray Outback Engineering Limited Edition

IID Pro MV License

17th Jul 2017 4:07am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

Thanks dgardel!

I see on BAS' website that they recommend doing the VCV and/or Pilot Correction learning on 'standard non tuned' engines - why wuld that be?

Surely if you are running a BAS remap permanently, then these should be done while the remap is on? --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

17th Jul 2017 8:32am

dgardel

Member Since: 30 Nov 2008
Location: Veneto (Heart & Head)
Posts: 3586

Simply, using the BAS tool, first re-load the standard tune, then do the PCV learning Procedure following the BAS tool instructions, 3rd re-load the BAS Map Discovery 5 td6 HSE Stornoway Gray Outback Engineering Limited Edition

IID Pro MV License

17th Jul 2017 9:32am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

thanks D, that makes sense for the VCV learn.

but it doesn't make sense for the Pilot Correction - if I look at the IID manual, it says the Pilote Correction learning is required when... "The engine ECU firmware is updated (or remapped)".

So surely one should set the map to factory for the VCV, and then load the BAS map, and then do the Pilot Correction?

--
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

17th Jul 2017 9:36am

dgardel

Member Since: 30 Nov 2008
Location: Veneto (Heart & Head)
Posts: 3586

I meant only for the PCV learning process. Pilot learning MUST be done with the remap loaded Discovery 5 td6 HSE Stornoway Gray Outback Engineering Limited Edition

IID Pro MV License

17th Jul 2017 3:07pm

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

great, thanks for clarifying!

--
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

17th Jul 2017 4:07pm

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

Someone I know suggested that I do the VCV and Pilot Learning to see if these would solve the issue.

I returned the Puma to the factory map and re-did the VCV learn. I then re-uploaded the BAS map and then did the Pilot correction.

This morning the white smoke was not as bad as previous days, but it was also not as cold last night, so difficult to tell if there was any effect. --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

27th Jul 2017 9:34am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

gents, the VCV has been replaced and the pump relearn done, but the problem is still there.

What do I do now???

--
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

18th Aug 2017 6:45am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2640

Anyone?

If it is the glow plugs, how do I test this?

if it is the injectors, what readings can I look at on the IID tool to diagnose?

thanks for any help! --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

22nd Aug 2017 8:23am

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