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| schuee Member Since: 16 Jul 2012 Location: Lincolnshire Posts: 378   
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Morning Churchy,
Funnily enough I have been experiencing very similar episodes as you have posted. I have found engine idle eratic especially when we had a spot of cold weather a while ago though when engine warms up runs great, and whilst this was happening the engine sounded like a bag of spanners, very clattery. I had another EGR fitted late last year ( 3rd one ) as when turning engine off, it was making a horrible screeching noise, so I'm looking at having a stage one remap and having it disabled when out of extended warranty, going back to your problem, it may be your VCV valve, and from other forum members discussions, the VCV doesn't throw any DTC's when it is faulty, so I have asked my dealer to replace as a bit of an excercise to see if this will cure problem, I also have experienced the same issue after filling up with BP Ultimate. Hopefully after new VCV will see if there is any improvement, will let you know mate. http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic30222....rough+idle http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic49491....rough+idle Cheers Keith |
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11th Jun 2017 8:16am |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20376
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Clean MAF & MAP sensors would be a good start.
 $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
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11th Jun 2017 9:38am |
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| churchy Member Since: 28 Jul 2011 Location: UK Posts: 237 
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Thats my plan today! What sort of cleaners recommended? will need to google their location too!
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11th Jun 2017 10:06am |
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| churchy Member Since: 28 Jul 2011 Location: UK Posts: 237
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Cleaned maf and map and things a little better buthave noticed the egr doing its cleaning noise intermittently when driving!?
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11th Jun 2017 1:11pm |
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| ericvv Member Since: 02 Jun 2011 Location: Near the Jet d'Eau Posts: 5816  
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It is normal that the EGR is opening and closing during driving, and that you hear it doing that. EGR only opens when plenty power is asked, but when power demand eases it will close again. Now it is then not the 5 chukkas of the cleaning cycle obviously, only should be one.
Eric You never actually own a Defender. You merely look after it for the next generation. http://youtu.be/yVRlSsJwD0o https://youtu.be/vmPr3oTHndg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GtzTT9Pdl0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABqKPz28e6A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLZ49Jce_n0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvAsz_ilQYU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8tMHiX9lSw https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dxwjPuHIV7I https://vimeo.com/201482507 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSixqL0iyHw |
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11th Jun 2017 2:17pm |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20376
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Holts brake cleaner Aerosol is perfectly okay for cleaning the sensors, and solvent based.
The EGR making noises whilst driving can happen, but it should be barely noticable. You could try un-plugging the EGR, but only if you can clear the MIL when it illuminates on the dash. My guess is it's probably slightly sticky / sticking open a little. MAF and EGR codes are often accompanying, so can often go hand in hand, typically the EGR is the culprit. For now, I'd clean your MAP and MAF and run some Millers diesel additive. And see how you go from there.
*edit* Just read you've already cleaned the sensors, at least you've had some reward from that. It must be the EGR then, when mine started making noises whilst driving it nearly always was on its way out.  $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
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11th Jun 2017 3:25pm |
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| churchy Member Since: 28 Jul 2011 Location: UK Posts: 237
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Thanks Steve - which particular milers product is best? If no change will remove egr and clean ideally before approaching the replace idea!
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11th Jun 2017 6:36pm |
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| Jerry Member Since: 13 Nov 2015 Location: Cardiff Posts: 197 
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I also have lumpy idle (mainly) when cold on first starting up. It disappears within 20secs or so, and runs great. I also use premium grade diesel...so either we all have VCV / sensor issues or maybe it is something to do with the premium diesel.... there is another similar post in Technical - would be interesting to get a consensus on this.
http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50069.html |
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14th Jun 2017 11:02am |
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| AlanH Member Since: 15 Mar 2010 Location: WA Posts: 242 
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My 2.4 is much the same when cold, although cold here is not as cold there of course. Lumpy, noisy and jerks when I take the foot off before cornering.
Both MAP and MAF have been cleaned and CVC changed but not much difference. When we go on a long trip I don't notice it as it warms quickly, it's just the short run to get the paper in the morning where it's at it's worst. The mechanic thinks it may be something to do with the remap as he can't find any reason for it. EGR was shut off with the remap as usual. AlanH. |
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27th Jun 2017 11:27pm |
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| churchy Member Since: 28 Jul 2011 Location: UK Posts: 237
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Well I am three diesel fills from empty whilst using millers and I have to say the general decrease in engine noise, smoother running including acceleration and fuel economy seem to be better. Hope its not just me willing it better! EGR still noisier than it used to be but not as noisy as it was!
Got MOT coming up so fingers x! |
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5th Jul 2017 2:04pm |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20376
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Good stuff isn't it. It should bring down emissions slightly also. $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
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5th Jul 2017 4:04pm |
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| zsd-puma Member Since: 09 Aug 2016 Location: Kent Posts: 2720 
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Is it actually closed properly, it could be stuck partially open. It's why they're better with a blanking plate fitted. |
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5th Jul 2017 9:52pm |
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| churchy Member Since: 28 Jul 2011 Location: UK Posts: 237
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Just thought I'd update - still using millers and as above it def made an improvement however did a long run down from Yorkshire yesterday and it didn't miss a beat - 'cruised' at 70-80 all the way HOWEVER when we came off the motorway for the last 30mins of the journey on a roads at every junction it started hunting and stalled occasionally. EGR still noisier than normal when driving and at engine shut down.
Been researching automotive carbon cleaning but something tells me to stay away from 'miracle cures' ! |
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14th Jul 2017 11:33am |
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| ROBBONTHEROCK Member Since: 23 Jun 2014 Location: Aberdeenshire Posts: 637  
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Take the hit and put a new VCV in.
If you look at all the transit forums, there are pages of comments / threads all saying the same thing. Seems the VCV are prone to failure and develop lumpy idle and stalling issues. I found on the web a denso training manual which goes into deep discussion on the Denso HP3 system, which is what is on a 2.4ltr duratorq. Will find it tonight and post a link to it, quite interesting reading. It outlines details about pre-injection and post injection, which is effectively a series of small injections ahead of and after the main injection phase, and reduces vibration / noise (knock) and temperature, which means the cylinder is more evenly heated during the combustion process. One interesting aspect is at present I can't tell yet whether the VCV is permanently moving (oscillating) or whether its more of a static setting and moves more intermittently. My defender has on occasion a lumpy idle and has hunted in very cold conditions. I have bought a new denso VCV and have it in the garage today being replaced (island 4x4, £78 excl VAT). It wasn't causing an issue per say, but I'm driving to Europe in two weeks so I want complete confidence. I've paired it with a new EGR as well. Cheers Andy PS I think the VCV failing, are in effect due to them seizing or sticking, causing the valve to shuttle incorrectly. moisture in the fuel system must be a potential culprit. Also its worth noting in the Denso training manual it does explain that the VCV sits in a open position (high fuel position) when off or low voltage, apparently that translates to a cold start. so perhaps faults with lumpy idle (not hunting) i.e. in a low fuel position would be when hot?? Another fascinating point, is the Denso injectors lift a maximum of 0.05mm when activated by the solenoid. I knew it would be small, but didn't think it would be as small as that. Last edited by ROBBONTHEROCK on 14th Jul 2017 6:55pm. Edited 2 times in total |
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14th Jul 2017 11:54am |
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