 | Home > Maintenance & Modifications > Fitting an automatic gearbox |
 
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| Go Beyond Member Since: 30 Jan 2012 Location: Headcorn, Kent Posts: 6678  
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They do become a lot more sluggish but a remap really sorts it out
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23rd Jul 2015 6:43am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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I'd try before you buy. If it's the same gearbox fitted to 300TDi Disco's then it's a long way behind what any modern automatic is.
Four gears are just not enough; but the biggest failing is the time it takes to start moving from pressing the accelerator. i used to have to navigate a very busy T junction every day. You'd see the gap, press the accelerator and then watch as the gap disappeared before you started to move. Great off roading though. |
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23rd Jul 2015 7:42am |
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| Pam W Member Since: 25 Oct 2011 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 1169  
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My td5 is auto - we convert all our Defenders to Auto.
I've not found it sluggish at all. You have to learn how to get the kick down right to match when the turbo kicks in, but, more importantly, on the modern LR engines you really need to set the gear changes up to match your driving style and load etc. I'm not sure which auto box Ashcrofts supply for the tdci, but for the td5 it is the later electronic version of the zf. This was fitted to the disco 2 td5, or (slightly different) the P38 RR. The older 'mechanical' zf can be used with the td5 (not sure about the tdci) but cannot be set up and kick down points and thus acceleration rates are compromised. I'd say ask Ashcrofts if they can sort out a test drive of one they already did, or ask around on the forums as I'm sure they are a few people around who have already converted. I'd say go for it, we certainly have no regrets. Just love our autos!! Our blog - http://landytravels.com/ Yorkshire Off Road Club - http://www.yorkshireoffroadclub.net |
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24th Jul 2015 7:15am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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I think mine were both mechanical versions , so maybe the issue was resolved for later models; but to be clear the sluggishness I'm talking about was only from rest on initial move off.
A very definite lag between pressing the accelerator and the wheels starting to move. So nothing to do with either kick down or turbos. |
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24th Jul 2015 7:52am |
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| Alex1976 Member Since: 23 Jan 2013 Location: Buckingham Posts: 596
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I converted my 300tdi 90 to auto using the Ashcroft kit. I love it and don't find I have any problems with pull away or gear change and that's on a standard 4 speed ZF non electronic box.
I do have a VGT turbo fitted and tweeked the fuel pump etc so maybe that is why I feel it doesn't suffer from lack of pull away. I would certainly get another auto Defender as I love how they drive. I think a more modern elcetronic controlled box matched to a proper tune on a Puma would be really good. |
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24th Jul 2015 11:25am |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8050  
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you will never make the Def drive like a Discovery from an engine/gobx relationship in my opinion the best you will probably get is if you fit the V6 with drivetrain.
i run two autos both on TGVs. both are Ashcroft monster non electronic boxes. the truck cab run 33" tyres with a the std sized TC, if i floor it, it will chirp the MTs on tarmac on upchange. the trayback is running 37" with a 4.6TC, high range granted it struggles in lower gears. Tops about 50mph in Low which is where it spends most of its life (low that is not 50mph!) Dave A has a demo 90 with the electronic box fitted for test drives, i believe Pete does the mapping to suit a TDCi with Auto? If the time is spent setting the electronics up to suit the engine output with the compushift i reckon it would work very well, but have never driven that specific set up. my comment is based on smaller tyres and similar power/torque output of tdci compared to my truck cab TGV. Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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24th Jul 2015 11:48am |
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| Skeggy 90 Member Since: 07 Oct 2013 Location: Skeg Vegas Posts: 233 
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I have driven a number of Auto TDCI Defenders, one thing worth considering is fitting an Ashcroft ATB centre diff at the same time to reduce the slack in the driveline. This makes a noticeable difference to how they drive. I know Motor and Diesel were working on fitting the Mercedes Auto box to a Defender, this is a lot more modern gearbox than the Discovery 2 gearbox with Compushift. main problem is going from a 6 speed manual to a 4 speed auto with converter lock up that is engaged at a set speed and not load sensitive.
There are also a few options on shifters and centre consoles. 90 300 TDI SW (sold) 130 TD5 Utility (Foley SV) (sold) 110 TD5 Hardtop (sold) 110 TDCI Utility (sold) 1st Edition Range Rover Sport Supercharged Velar P380 HSE Discovery 1 V8 auto Puma 130 Double Cab (sold) R35 GTR Defender 110 300 TDI CSW (sold) 2010 110 XS Utility |
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24th Jul 2015 5:20pm |
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| Pickles Member Since: 26 May 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 3785  
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Never seen or driven an auto Defender, but I will just make an observation, which may, or may not be, correct.
The Defender is not the fastest vehicle on the planet, nor is it the most responsive, particularly in on road conditions, nor is it meant to be. Of course, Off road is another matter altogether, where the Defender is pretty much unbeatable & unstoppable. However, I just can't see where a 2-2.5L 4cyl Diesel engine with say 120 or even modified to 150HP with a 4Sp. auto pulling a 4WD vehicle of the Defender's weight would make for satisfying driving,....wouldn't matter whether it was a Defender or whatever, the weight of the vehicle with that amount of power with an auto is always going to make for slow, very slow going, particularly off the mark, & overtaking at higher speeds would also take some time. All this may be quite ok for some, but for me, it would be just too slow. If I wanted an auto, I'd want a much more powerful bigger capacity engine, & preferably a 6 speed auto, but the GM 4L80 is also good behind a V8. So, c'mon guys, let's get real, the only way for an auto is to repower with a GM 6.2L LS3 V8, with matching 6 speed auto? Don't rubbish me too much, Pickles. |
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24th Jul 2015 10:22pm |
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| RobKeay Member Since: 19 Jul 2009 Location: Stafford Posts: 1582 
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D2 with an auto box and a chip isn't too bad a drive. The d2 box is old fashioned now but is alright. I would rather have an auto, being able to change gear doesn't make you the driver you think you are.
But there is something satisfying about when you able to drive a defender smoothly. |
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24th Jul 2015 10:47pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8050
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yep, i concure can alaways change axle ratios to help with a defender which could be option for the OP Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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25th Jul 2015 7:34am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Talking of weight - I had a few occasions to pull a decently heavy trailer up and down the old A1 (before they removed the roundabouts). It caused trouble every time with the gearbox overheating as I accelerated through the gears after each roundabout. Maybe it would just need an additional oil cooler? |
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25th Jul 2015 7:46am |
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| MadTom Member Since: 10 Sep 2013 Location: Olomouc Posts: 625  
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Take Discovery 2 with TD5 engine, auto gearbox, standard size tyres and bigger torque converter. With slight engine tune, it is very nice to drive, and the weight is comparable to Defender. And if you are going this way, you have to hold the overall gearing - bigger tires needs slower gears in diffs or in transfer box.
I have 130 TD5 HCPU and D2 TD5 - when the 130 is empty, it is lighter than the D2.  Both has manual gearbox and 235/85/R16 tires. 130 has stock engine, D2 remapped. Up to 100km/h 130 is better, because of lower transfer box gearing. So I think, maintain correct gearing is the most important part of any modification. "Drobek" = The Small One - Discovery 2, "BlufÃnek" = The Blue Thing - Defender 130, and for me at least Ford Mondeo  |
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25th Jul 2015 9:29am |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8050
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for maintain gearing quote Cheers
James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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27th Jul 2015 6:31pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Well they did in September of last year! Not seen anyone mention it before on here - or have I missed the thread?
"A 6-speed tiptronic automatic gearbox for Land Rover Defenders has been developed and introduced by Land Rover specialists JE MotorWorks. The engineering team at Coventry-based JE – which has been modifying, tuning and building Land Rovers for 40 years – have developed a gearbox which seamlessly integrates with the Defender 4×4 system, and which yields 10-12% improved fuel economy and considerably quicker acceleration than the quarter-century-old OE 4-speed auto box. “The 6-speed is a heavily modified version of a Ford gearbox more often seen in current-day Ford Mustang, Ford Ranger and Ford F150 pickup models, and from the very first test drive we all felt it seemed made for the Defender,” said David O’Connor of JE MotorWorks. “Our engineering team, which has a track record of providing consultancy and developmental input to several major car manufacturers and engine makers, created a kit to convert the 6-speed for use in the Defender – maintaining both the standard Defender 4×4 system and the tiptronic feature of the gearbox. “Simply put, it’s faster, more economical, more relaxed to drive, more versatile, and never leaves the driver wanting. “We’ve been re-designing and re-engineering Land Rovers for 40 years, to the extent that even Land Rover has bought the rights to some of the engineering, performance and technology ideas we’ve developed and deployed in our own cars.” The 6-speed automatic gearbox installation is priced at £8,860 plus VAT, and is available now. Customers can experience the 6-speed in JE’s demonstrator vehicles. JE played a big part in helping the automotive world realise that Range Rovers could be performance cars – and created the first high-performance Land Rover Defenders." It now modifies, enhances and tunes the full range of petrol and diesel Land Rover and Range Rover models – including current-day versions – and produces the world’s fastest Land Rover Defender at its Siskin Drive HQ, near Coventry Airport." http://jemotorworks.co.uk/je-introduces-la...o-gearbox/ Sounds a nice conversion on paper - anyone any experience of how it actually drives? |
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9th Feb 2016 12:03pm |
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