Home > Puma (Tdci) > DPF removal - the facts |
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x-isle Member Since: 26 May 2011 Location: Midlands Posts: 1327 |
Personally, I find it funny and annoying that someone from the US puts his thoughts about emissions. Tar and brush springs to mind.
The fact is, control of emissions is here to stay and will get more stringent. That can only be a good thing in any country. Hopefully, it'll mean more advanced controls that don't cause owners hassle. However, I still think that most of the "removers" don't remove them because they are broken, the remove them because they think that it's going to make such a huge difference that their sluggish Turbo Diesels suddenly have the power of the Diesel Le Mans cars. I don't believe the laws around emissions controls are stupid at all. For those that don't agree with them, then they are not in place to protect you, they are there for everyone else. ....and I hope that the hassles of failing MOTs become more than the hassle of removing them in the first place. I don't know what's happened to the folk on here lately. There does seem to be a lot of hot headed people stirring things up. Maybe it's down to them breathing their own dirty fumes from their decats? It used to be a great place, lately, it's turned into the House of Commons. I guess there'll always be the split of opinion, personally, for me, people purposely modifying vehicles to knowingly increase emissions is an arrogant selfish attitude to the rest of the world. You may all say; "....but it still passes the MOT". That's not the point. The MOT doesn't test emissions in the real world and it only has a benchmark figure. That figure isn't something to aim for, it's something to aim higher than. Craig Rogers 2007 Puma 110 XS 2011 Evoque Coupe Dynamic Lux www.craigrogers.photography Last edited by x-isle on 6th Feb 2014 9:13am. Edited 1 time in total |
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6th Feb 2014 9:11am |
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RockJaw Member Since: 15 Oct 2013 Location: United States Posts: 317 |
Not sure whether this applies to UK models but from what I understand the light will only really come on when the computer senses a drop in pressure signalling the need to perform a DPF regeneration. Soot build up occurs differently for different vehicles. Some vehicles are constantly under low revs and working hard all day - these will experience a high frequency of regeneration because of a rapid build up of particulates in the DPF. Other vehicles which are used for long trips with less load will not build up soot and will not experience DPF regeneration for long intervals. Nothing to be too concerned about, at least not if my understanding of it is accurate. ****CENSORED**** |
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6th Feb 2014 9:28am |
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x-isle Member Since: 26 May 2011 Location: Midlands Posts: 1327 |
The DPF just does it's thing without any driver feedback under normal conditions.
You need to be more worried if the light does come on. The Defender DPF is a pretty clever box of tricks that is designed to regenerate at lower speeds than normal DPFs. I don't know if this is correct, however, I think the DPF light has 2 stages. Orange means take it for a spin to help burn or Red which means it's a trip to the dealer. Craig Rogers 2007 Puma 110 XS 2011 Evoque Coupe Dynamic Lux www.craigrogers.photography |
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6th Feb 2014 9:32am |
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RockJaw Member Since: 15 Oct 2013 Location: United States Posts: 317 |
One Life - Live It!! ****CENSORED****
Last edited by RockJaw on 6th Feb 2014 10:27am. Edited 1 time in total |
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6th Feb 2014 9:42am |
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RockJaw Member Since: 15 Oct 2013 Location: United States Posts: 317 |
@ x-isle Do you or anyone know what set of sensors triggers the red light? The orange is a warning, as i understand, that a pressure drop or something has occurred and regeneration is either already in progress or that it is imminent. Red? System too clogged up? Regeneration failed? Immobiliser soon to kick in? One of the remap guys would know the answer to this one. Another important issue for me is whether the 2.2 also injects diesel during the exhaust stroke in order to facilitate DPF regeneration or other management function, this might explain some of the higher fuel consumption we all experience over the 2.4 Pumas. ****CENSORED**** Last edited by RockJaw on 6th Feb 2014 10:13am. Edited 1 time in total |
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6th Feb 2014 10:10am |
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x-isle Member Since: 26 May 2011 Location: Midlands Posts: 1327 |
My understanding is;
Orange: It needs to regenerate but it's too full and needs more pressure to do so. A hard drive is required to activate the regeneration Red: The DPF is overfull and regeneration cannot start in any driving conditions. I suspect the ECU will enter limp home mode. Craig Rogers 2007 Puma 110 XS 2011 Evoque Coupe Dynamic Lux www.craigrogers.photography |
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6th Feb 2014 10:13am |
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RockJaw Member Since: 15 Oct 2013 Location: United States Posts: 317 |
So it relies exclusively on the pressure sensors, which makes sense. ****CENSORED****
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6th Feb 2014 10:14am |
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x-isle Member Since: 26 May 2011 Location: Midlands Posts: 1327 |
Again, this is just my understanding, so could be wrong;
A DPF works on back pressure to determine it's "fullness", so yes, it would be pressure sensor(s). Craig Rogers 2007 Puma 110 XS 2011 Evoque Coupe Dynamic Lux www.craigrogers.photography |
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6th Feb 2014 10:16am |
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borderterrier Member Since: 09 Dec 2011 Location: Surrey Posts: 1677 |
You are very welcome. |
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6th Feb 2014 10:21am |
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Japseroony Member Since: 02 Jan 2008 Location: North East England Posts: 807 |
Just some thoughts and comments having just read this thread.
In order to buy a number plate for any vehicle you need to provide the V5, proof of address and also ID. So when someone sells one as a show number plate that is too small, has the incorrect lettering type or for any other reason is not legitimate and then the person that has bought it fits it to their car who is at fault It’s the same for most aftermarket motorbike exhausts that say "not for road use" and then someone fitting it to their road bike - who is at fault borderterrier, you seem to have taken a stance here but cannot justify why and especially when having a rant against Pete from BAS just because he added a after a comment he made. As Pete has said he has been asked as a tuner to modify a tune for a DFP off for a specific application - surely who he sells that too is up to him and the person that wants to buy it. Also, have you asked Gary or Ian to comment on this I notice from posts on here that Gary specifically sells de-cats for TD5s and 2.4 TDCi to name 2, link here; http://www.alivetuning.com/alive-boutique/...uct_id=138 and Ian has a specific tune for a 2.2 TDCi that turns off the DPF and is for a de-cat car, link here; http://www.irbdevelopments.com/2.2%20Tuning.html and link here for the 2.4TDCi http://www.irbdevelopments.com/2.4%20Tuning.html I do recall, but I can’t find the thread at this time, that Ian has specifically written a file 2.4 dedicated for a de-cat pipe and presumably the same for the 2.2 indicating this is a calibration change for road use and without a cat with the same for the 2.2 i.e. a dedicated tune for a car with no DPF, when Pete has never stated his tune is for a de-cat off or cat on as it’s up to the end user. Finally, Pete does not and has not publically sold a de-cat exhaust for many years nor does he advertise them for sale anywhere, whereas the other 2 resident tuners specifically sell and advertise de-cat pipes both on their website and at shows – more importantly they claim a dedicated tune for a de-cat pipe and the latter for a car with DPF off. I suggest you remove your head from up your and speak to those that in your words are “ irresponsible” and stop having a go at those that don’t currently promote such items for general use Gas, Grass Or Ass - Nobody Rides For Free "UNDERSTEER" ----is when you hit the fence with the front of the car. "OVERSTEER" ------is when you hit the fence with the rear of the car. "HORSEPOWER" ----is how fast you hit the fence. "TORQUE" -----------is how far you take the fence with you. |
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6th Feb 2014 1:33pm |
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Porny Site Sponsor Member Since: 31 Aug 2009 Location: Sutton Coldfield - West Midlands Posts: 809 |
As per the links to my website... For 2.2 Defender - Option of DPF/ Catalytic Converter removal. This is on option as determined by customer usage. We are not just talking UK markets, and not all Defenders end up in their designated markets. For example I have been involved converting a UK spec Defender to be shipped to a None EU5 market. If this wasn't done - the standard of fuel available would destroy the DPF. In this case the ECU was reflashed to make it into a EU4 spec with a None DPF. Nothing wrong with this. If a customer required this for the UK they would be advised that it would be in contradiction of the original vehicles type approval - and advised that under the new MOT regulations it would be a failure. A disclaimer would have to be signed. And any supplied pipework would be stamped correctly with "“ILLEGAL TO SUPPLY FOR VEHICLES APPROVED TO EC REGULATION 715/2007.” The exemptions to this would be if the engine was fitted in a older vehicle and thus it would not have to meet EU5 standards or a vehicle that had gone through the SVA/IVA process. So, to cover all areas development work covers DPF and None DPF usage. And although more relevant to the other DPF/CAT threads that are running at the moment... Again, to cover all possibilities I have developed by CAT and none CAT calibrations for 2.4. Why - because this is only proper way of doing it properly! Removing the CAT changes the air path models, and more importantly changes the back pressure. There is no way that - done properly - you can have a one calibration fits all. Customers will always be advised and will be given the option - all comes down to vehicle usage and customer requirements. Exhaust systems will be marked as required. With ref to the latest MOT requirements - they will be informed. And MOT regulations are very different to Type Approvals.... Ian IRB The home of the first modified Keswick Green 90 - and the first 2.4 Puma through both the 200bhp and 550Nm barriers. www.IRBdevelopments.com www.facebook.com/irbdevelopments www.integrated316.com www.facebook.com/integrated316 |
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6th Feb 2014 5:36pm |
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borderterrier Member Since: 09 Dec 2011 Location: Surrey Posts: 1677 |
Ian that's clear. Thank you for answering. Out of interest do you record exhaust emissions during map development at all?
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6th Feb 2014 5:46pm |
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Porny Site Sponsor Member Since: 31 Aug 2009 Location: Sutton Coldfield - West Midlands Posts: 809 |
In terms of being MOT compliant for a smoke test yes.... (especially with regards to Tdci - fast pass for post 2008 is a much lower limit). Even my highly tuned 2.4 Tdci will pass without a problem.
A full emissions test over a EU2000 cylcle is very different... but something I might know a bit about. Ian IRB The home of the first modified Keswick Green 90 - and the first 2.4 Puma through both the 200bhp and 550Nm barriers. www.IRBdevelopments.com www.facebook.com/irbdevelopments www.integrated316.com www.facebook.com/integrated316 |
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6th Feb 2014 5:54pm |
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bell-auto-services Member Since: 08 Jul 2007 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 2232 |
borderterrier, Reply sent to the pm you sent me.
Pete |
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6th Feb 2014 8:16pm |
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