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NoDo$h



Member Since: 18 Aug 2007
Location: Buried in deer guts in Dorset
Posts: 972
England 
Cider..... Mr. Green 

54 Freelander modded for mud
2008 D3 SE
2010 90 XS SW
1978 88 Series 3 undergoing surgery with a new owner
2007 90 County Truck Cab - gone
2006 D3 SE - gone
2004 Freelander Sport - gay
1999 Disco V8 ES rotted to bits
Post #187352 23rd Nov 2012 12:58am
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ZeDefender



Member Since: 15 Sep 2011
Location: Munich
Posts: 4731
Germany 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Baltic Blue
Cider - 3 bottles left over from Guy Fawkes (just woke up) Thumbs Up Tell someone you love them today because life is short.
But shout it at them in German because life is also terrifying and confusing...
Post #187365 23rd Nov 2012 8:16am
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SteveG



Member Since: 29 Nov 2011
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 659
2005 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Belize Green
dgardel wrote:
SteveG the ECE homologation is dominant

JWS LED headlamps is ECE R112, for the law are the same as the bulbs one......


I thought we'd covered all we could, but as you posted to me I'll reply. It's not. It's the same for HID, you have plenty of e type approved HID headlamps on the market, but in the UK you can't legally retro fit them without self levelling and washers.

The only headlamp units you can legally retro fit without self levelling and washers are filament due to 1989 legislation. New cars are exempt as UK accepts European type approval for new cars. Having said that, for some years European type approval has required self levelling and washers for high intensity headlamps like HID and LED.

Tim is stating that he has direct exemption from VOSA for the JW Speaker lamps. I've yet to see this, so I can't comment properly on why they are exempt. However, I take his word for it and going by his replies, it seems he got this exemption as their light output is not enough to be considered high intensity. So with this exemption you can fit the JW Speaker lights without self levelling and washers.

Personally, I think the DfT stance is fair. We all experience on a weekly basis glare from cars with either incorrectly set headlamps or poor aftermarket HID kits. This is the reason why it's been introduced into MOT to make sure they are maintained properly. Again personally, I don't think it's outrageous to request retro fit of high intensity headlamps to meet the same requirements as required for new cars.

Hand on heart, how many, when loading up the Defender for a weekends off roading religeously adjust the headlamp levelling to get beam back to an acceptable dipped level? Nobody can deny that with high intensity lights there is a need for this, hence self levelling requirement.

Cheers

Steve Smile
Post #187373 23rd Nov 2012 8:42am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018
United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
SteveG wrote:
...you have plenty of e type approved HID headlamps on the market, but in the UK you can't legally retro fit them without self levelling and washers.


I know this is a Defender forum, but the above advice could be taken to be all encompassing. When this subject was discussed on another car forum I frequent the following advice came to light:

"It is also worthy of note that a few high performance vehicles fitted with HID headlamps that have barely any luggage space and stiff suspension do not require a self-levelling system."

This is from a VOSA guidance note, the full text of which is here:

http://www.partinfo.co.uk/files/MOT%20Changes%20-%20Lighting.pdf
Post #187387 23rd Nov 2012 9:50am
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SteveG



Member Since: 29 Nov 2011
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 659
2005 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Belize Green
The doc you link to also has this wording....

"Headlamp washing and levelling systems are mandatory for all vehicles fitted with LED headlamp systems, although these are not yet widely used and only tend to be optional fitment on some executive marques. However, as LED systems improve and because they can be arranged in almost any design configuration, they are sure to become more common.

Where headlamp levelling or cleaning devices are missing or defective, but there is doubt as to whether they are required, the benefit of the doubt should be given and an advisory notice issued."

As before though this is for MOT. Legality of car is determined by current legislation and any exceptions that the DfT may see fit to issue.
Post #187397 23rd Nov 2012 10:27am
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K9F



Member Since: 12 Nov 2009
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 9610
United Kingdom 2008 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
I'm considering fitting dustcaps that have a rubber cap under which is a Schrader valve. Wondering what the 'legislation spin' will be on that one?

Anyone care to shed a little light or comment perhaps? Whistle

Don't know if I would be able to cope if I received an advisory on my next MOT.

This thread despite having JW Speakers fitted myself is becoming 'tiring' now! Thought the issue of fitment was done and dusted ages ago?

Obviously until Tim comes up with the goods the rules and regulations are open to personal interpretation. If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!

Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!!

Last edited by K9F on 23rd Nov 2012 10:41am. Edited 1 time in total
Post #187402 23rd Nov 2012 10:39am
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ken



Member Since: 18 Aug 2009
Location: Banging Birds with my bitches !!
Posts: 4328
United Kingdom 
What Knapweed said Mr. Green
Post #187403 23rd Nov 2012 10:41am
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K9F



Member Since: 12 Nov 2009
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 9610
United Kingdom 2008 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
ken wrote:
What Knapweed said Mr. Green


Anyone we know? Nuff said...... Thumbs Up

 If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!

Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!!
Post #187404 23rd Nov 2012 10:43am
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ken



Member Since: 18 Aug 2009
Location: Banging Birds with my bitches !!
Posts: 4328
United Kingdom 

Click image to enlarge

Mr. Green
Post #187413 23rd Nov 2012 11:29am
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mobilecentre



Member Since: 05 Mar 2012
Location: Evesham
Posts: 645
United Kingdom 
I am still waiting for the written statment from the DFT that all LED headlights are illegal Whistle
Post #187581 23rd Nov 2012 7:10pm
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K9F



Member Since: 12 Nov 2009
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 9610
United Kingdom 2008 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
Me I don't give a flying f***! Happy with the product, got an MOT so no faffing with swapouts, will just have to stove them in in the event of them surviving a smash NOT!

Expect a HUGE discount if I have to replace. Cool If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!

Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!!
Post #187591 23rd Nov 2012 7:25pm
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mobilecentre



Member Since: 05 Mar 2012
Location: Evesham
Posts: 645
United Kingdom 
K9F wrote:
Me I don't give a flying f***! Happy with the product, got an MOT so no faffing with swapouts, will just have to stove them in in the event of them surviving a smash NOT!

Expect a HUGE discount if I have to replace. Cool


Of course we are here to help Thumbs Up
Post #187592 23rd Nov 2012 7:26pm
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Lishlandy



Member Since: 26 Oct 2011
Location: High Wycombe
Posts: 941
England 2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 X-Tech LE Orkney Grey
Hi Tim, any luck on the grill protection availabilities for the svx front that we spoke about on the other thread? ===================================
Steve
90 xs sw in Stonoway Grey - Sold
110 USW X-TECH
Post #187625 23rd Nov 2012 8:51pm
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adafish



Member Since: 30 Mar 2009
Location: atherstone
Posts: 1381
United Kingdom 1984 Defender 110 300 Tdi DCPU Stornoway Grey
any luck on the LED bulbs....just fitted some in the kitchen down lighters....what a difference... Putting Dreams on Drives at JLR Solihull..
Post #187626 23rd Nov 2012 8:57pm
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mobilecentre



Member Since: 05 Mar 2012
Location: Evesham
Posts: 645
United Kingdom 
I already have LED bulbs in my kitchen - they are not E marked though Embarassed
Post #187635 23rd Nov 2012 9:14pm
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