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Home > Puma (Tdci) > Puma not starting after stalling.[SOLVED] Likely fuel filter
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
Puma not starting after stalling.[SOLVED] Likely fuel filter
Hey guys,
I went on a road trip beginning of this month, did 3000 Kms with the defender not missing a bit. Came back, got busy at work and I'd say this morning was the first time using it after the trip that was 3 weeks ago. Battery is new but I did not think too much about it, car started directly, done 2-3 kilometres with no problem, then the engine was a bit funky, not taking is rpms in a linear way. Afterwards, engine stalled at a red light, hard to restart but it eventually did. I tried to keep higher rpm for the last kilometer so I could park it at work, I made it, left it on for a couple of minutes see if it would stall again. Motor was still really hesitant but stayed on, so I stopped it and did other things.. Now I am back to really hard to start again.. I haven't tried too long because I don't wanna drain the battery.

Tank is between 1/4 and 1/3 full.. First thing that came too mind was definitely a diesel related problem, not sure if I should just force it back home or let it sit here and check other things first... Happened r4 mins after a pedestrian came knock at the window while I was stopped to tell me how cool this car was ๐Ÿ˜‚ Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)


Last edited by Waka56 on 7th Nov 2024 7:32pm. Edited 2 times in total
Post #1049919 27th Oct 2024 11:27am
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20413

United Kingdom 
Likely to be VCV, or grounding issues is worth checking such as battery clamps are tight and main electrical points. $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธโ›ฝ๏ธ๐Ÿ›ข๏ธโš™๏ธ๐Ÿงฐ๐Ÿ’ช
Post #1049920 27th Oct 2024 11:58am
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
It the car not starting for a couple of weeks something that helps the VCV dying unexpectedly? Haven't had weird symptoms beforehand. Thanks anyway ๐Ÿ‘ Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1049921 27th Oct 2024 12:05pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20413

United Kingdom 
Itโ€™s worth checking the battery voltage at rest to see what that is reading at, and that the alternator is producing correct voltage spec with the engine running.

The VCV can be affected by contaminants in fuel, such as water but you can get diesel bug too but usually it will sit many many many months longer than youโ€™ve suggested for that to be much of an issue.

VCV failure will cause the engine to cut out, the only solution is to replace it which isnโ€™t expensive but it is worth checking other things first, such as battery condition etc.

Hope that helps, there are some other possibilities too such as injectors etc but VCV failiureis way more common than that. $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธโ›ฝ๏ธ๐Ÿ›ข๏ธโš™๏ธ๐Ÿงฐ๐Ÿ’ช
Post #1049926 27th Oct 2024 12:52pm
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
Battery is fine, since the car does not start anymore, I can't check the alternator, but I think it's doing its job. Could the VCV actually stop the engine from starting? Seeing more rough idle story and cut out. I guess I'll have to find someone that can check if the diesel is coming to the injectors, really feels like a fueling problem. Confused

Edit: I do believe that I had some bad diesel at some point, I nearly emptied the tank once and afterwards the injectors made a bit more noise for a while. Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1049927 27th Oct 2024 12:59pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20413

United Kingdom 
Yes I believe it can, and poor idle and hunting / fluctuating idle when cold is a known symtom.

Do you happen to know how old it is? (The VCV).
Some have a pretty good life, others not so much. $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธโ›ฝ๏ธ๐Ÿ›ข๏ธโš™๏ธ๐Ÿงฐ๐Ÿ’ช
Post #1049945 27th Oct 2024 4:40pm
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
No I have no idea when it was changed, only got the car for a year now. Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1049965 27th Oct 2024 6:30pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20413

United Kingdom 
Iโ€™d suggest going for a new VCV then as prices are quite reasonable and you wonโ€™t need to do any learn process.

Is it a 2.4 or 2.2?, a 2.4 is a bit easier to do it on but both are okay.

A failing VCV flags no DTC or MIL (Amber Dash Light).

Beyond that, possibly prior to going that route clean the MAF & MAP sensors. $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธโ›ฝ๏ธ๐Ÿ›ข๏ธโš™๏ธ๐Ÿงฐ๐Ÿ’ช
Post #1049966 27th Oct 2024 6:35pm
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
Yeah I guess it would not be a complete waste of 100โ‚ฌ, but I can't find cases where the VCV does not let the engine start. The VCV problems seems to go away whenever you restart the car and come back later. Confused right now haha. And 2.4 Thumbs Up Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1049972 27th Oct 2024 7:23pm
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jst



Member Since: 14 Jan 2008
Location: Taunton
Posts: 8045

 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Stornoway Grey
I have changed a vcv on a rough running vehicle and it then wouldn't start. Took new off checked it and refitted, still wouldn't start.

Fitted another one new one and it worked perfectly.

In your case it wouldn't hurt to check/change fuel filter and check fuel is getting through to engine. Could just be crap in pipe. Or watery diesel that's corroded vcv. Cheers

James
110 2012 XS Utility
130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper
90 2010 Hardtop
90 M57 1988 Hardtop
Post #1049984 27th Oct 2024 8:32pm
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Ianh



Member Since: 17 Sep 2018
Location: Essex
Posts: 2019

United Kingdom 
Test your camshaft and crankshaft sensors and wiring. See https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic92421...ank+sensor especially posts by Blackwolf.
blackwolf wrote:
The camshaft position sensor is also critical when starting (since without a reading fro it the ECM cannot determine which stroke the engine is on), once the engine is running it is not used. I don't think you have a camshaft sensor fault though because I don't think it would fire at all if this one wasn't working.

It could be a weak signal from the crank position sensor such that the ECM is only picking up something recognisable above a certain engine speed, or it could be a fuel pump problem whereby there is insufficient pressure below a certain speed. It could be a VCV problem although I think this is actually less likely in this case. It could be that the PRV on the rail is leaking so that fuel rail pressure can only build up at higher engine speeds.

If I was investigating, the first thing I would be checking the fuel rail pressure when cranking, since this will help narrow down the problem.

Note that if the crank sensor is the problem I would expect normal fuel rail pressure when cranking, but the ECM won't be firing the injectors. If the PRV is leaking or the pump is faulty I'd expect low rail pressures and the ECM will be trying to fire the injectors.
Post #1049985 27th Oct 2024 8:36pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20413

United Kingdom 
IanH makes a good point there, there is those as well. Thumbs Up $W33T $0U7H3RN $UG4R
๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ฅ๓ ฎ๓ ง๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ท๓ ฌ๓ ณ๓ ฟ๐Ÿด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธโ›ฝ๏ธ๐Ÿ›ข๏ธโš™๏ธ๐Ÿงฐ๐Ÿ’ช
Post #1049988 27th Oct 2024 8:50pm
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
I guess I'll start with the crank and camshaft sensors. How do you test them? Is it a matter of cleaning them? Or just get 2 new ones and swap? They seem fairly cheap.

Okey, found online some tests for the crankshaft position sensor. I'll keep digging. Thanks guys!

How often does a high pressure fuel pump gives up out of the blue? (Yep, my brain always thinks of the pricy problems haha) Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1049990 27th Oct 2024 8:54pm
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Ianh



Member Since: 17 Sep 2018
Location: Essex
Posts: 2019

United Kingdom 
Do you have a code reader, it would help if you did to see if there are any recorded Diagnostic Trouble Codes. (DTCโ€™s).
Post #1049998 27th Oct 2024 10:55pm
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Waka56



Member Since: 08 Nov 2023
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 162

Germany 
I did not have it in the car, I'll check today ๐Ÿ‘ Making my Defender great again. (Or trying to at least xD)
Post #1050003 28th Oct 2024 6:21am
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