 | Home > Maintenance & Modifications > Defender M57 engine cooling issue |
 
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| Doby92 Member Since: 01 Jan 2025 Location: Mackay Posts: 4   
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Following your issue as I have similar, just completed a M57n with zf6 install. Runs on the flat around 92-95c at 100km/h on a 30c day. If i push it a bit it goes up to 100c.
I took it up a big 15% climb, takes about 20 minutes. The air temp was 31 degress c. With the electric fan locked on and only doing around 30km/h in high range it got to 110c at the top. I'm running an alisport cooling package, new water pump, new thermostat, 50/50 coolant mix and ute is light at around 2000kg. Wasn't expecting those high temps. Will be good to see what you find. FYI, I purchased a complete 2006 X5 for the donor and drove it the 1000km back from Brisbane to Mackay. Pushed it hard to see how it would perform, not a problem. Ran like a top. Maybe the old thermostat is better than the new one. |
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1st Jan 2025 1:59am |
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| Mo Murphy Member Since: 01 Jun 2008 Location: Letchworth Garden City, Herts Posts: 2248  
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How are you chaps cooling your gearboxes and how highly geared are your vehicles ?
For reference I am cooling both M57n engine and gearbox through what was a new standard Nissens OEM TD5/Puma radiator, big Darkside intercooler and using a 6hp (with original oil to water cooler) with 1.2 transfer box and 33" tyres. I'm using a Gates Thermostat and a Borg and Beck water pump with the original viscous fan, BMW coolant mixed at the recommended 3:1 ratio. In my experience, on steep sustained climbs in the mountains, in high ambients, it is best to put the gearbox in sport mode which holds the gears for longer and changes down more quickly preventing heat build up from slipping clutch packs in the gearbox. It also keeps you a gear down compared to normal drive mode and so keeps the revs up so getting more turns of the water pump. I've also noticed on some Facebook posts that some of those with high gearing using 1.1 and 1.0 transfer gearing seem to suffer at lower motorway speeds as they don't seem to be to be running high enough revs to to cycle the cooling system adequately. I've found it useful to monitor gearbox temperature which is available on the Can or the K line (i cant remember which now, probably the K line). In my particular instance of combined cooling, it helps me identify whether it's the gearbox or the engine that's generating heat and so I can take earlier steps to reduce temperatures. Just some more thoughts and considerations to throw into the pot. Mo The Land Rover 90 - Many are called, few are chosen. 50 Shades of Pennine Grey |
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1st Jan 2025 11:53am |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088  
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The lower gearing certainly causes issues. Mine sat at 60mph is 1900rpm which warms it up more than I would like.
As per my original posts sort the stat for one that opens at right temp and opens far enough, and then look at flow rate and it will work fine with most rads. Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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1st Jan 2025 12:00pm |
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| tommobot Member Since: 15 May 2018 Location: Stratford Upon Avon Posts: 27
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In my instance, it's definitely the engine generating heat, as the 8hp temps seem well in check. I'm glad it's not just me, and it does seem to be a fairly universal problem potentially. Id be all over the EWP, but all the UK ones want the mechanical water pump removing, the Stewart components one is the only one that will work alongside a normal pump - however it is circa £350... But id hope would overcome the problem! |
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1st Jan 2025 9:46pm |
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| Doby92 Member Since: 01 Jan 2025 Location: Mackay Posts: 4
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So I took the thermostat housing off and removed the thermostat from the housing and refitted the housing to the engine. Filled with coolant, ran it at high idle to get the air out with the heater on.
I have an electric fan wired through an 82c temp switch back to a dash switch so I can turn it off. I left it off for the test drive. It warmed up to 70c in the shed (31 here today) and out on the flat road pushing it where I could got up to 92c. I then took it on a back road and gunned it up a long steady 5-8% climb at 120km/h, it peeked at the top at 99c, starting at 93c at the bottom. Driving down the other side temps dropped to 88c. I have an oil to air trans cooler sitting in front of the intercooler, which is in front of the radiator, this adds heat to the rad as well. Trans temp peaked at 79c. Driving home it sat steady at 92/93c. I parked it in the shed running and switched the fan on, temp dropped down to 82c and fan switched off. Thermostat will not be going back in and I'm thinking I will move the trans cooler to below the radiator to remove more heat soak. Plan for this Defender is serious offroading towing a 2t Conqueror 490 offroad camper around Australia. Thanks everyone on here, the fix cost me nothing. Cheers |
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2nd Jan 2025 4:07am |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088
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The stat has a foot valve on it. If removing stat Block the water way the foot vale would close when stat is open. You then get more cooling as all coolant goes through rad. At rhe moment your getting bypass.
Mine used to get hot, 113 on a steep 20% mile climb towing. Vehicle is 3.5t towing 2.2t. Transcooler is also in front of rad. You can run ewp as an aux pump in top hose switched to only work when temp guage in top hose is at desired temp.ie after stat opening time. I am running modified stat, open at 76deg. Opens to 12mm. Fully open at 86/88. Since mod electric cooling fans rarely run. Ewp top hose switched to come on at 88deg. Drops temp to 75deg within 30s or so by increasing rad flow. Runs in conjunction with belt driven pump. I haven't seen 90 deg on scan guage at head since these two upgrades approx 2k miles ago. Simplist thing to do is check your stat. I have run approx 5k miles in mine since conversion and spent alot of time sorting the cooling. Currently only time my electric fan runs is in stop start traffic. It used to run almost constantly when flow was less and stat was poor. Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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2nd Jan 2025 11:19am |
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| MarkBrown Member Since: 03 Oct 2022 Location: Mid Wales Posts: 479  
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It’s interesting reading about this as I’ve had similar issues with my 606. It’s zf auto, 4 speed plus lock up, 255/ 85 tyres and 1.2. Never a problem on main road or motorways, but temperature will climb up steep, long hills. The best modification I did was to replace the smaller ( supposed to help cooling by running pump faster ) water pump pulley with the larger original one, this dropped the temperature by around ten degrees on the same hill. I lowered the inter cooler, that helped, and spread out the oil coolers to aid airflow.
I’ve a huge radiator fitted , I’m thinking that it might be too large, cooling the water too much and not allowing the thermostat to remain open until as it’s at the bottom of the engine, but that might be a thing. Maybe a warm system would work properly? The other issue I think the defender has is poor air flow as there’s not any vents or ducts to get rid of the heat when the car engines we’ve fitted get hot. Driving without the bonnet lowered the temperature by about 5 degrees. I know this is specifically about the m57, but there must be something we’re not getting right? 1983 110 automatic OM606 |
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2nd Jan 2025 4:00pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088
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Adding air vents to the of the bonnet on my tgvs brought temps down by circa 10 deg C. Cheers
James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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2nd Jan 2025 4:17pm |
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| MarkBrown Member Since: 03 Oct 2022 Location: Mid Wales Posts: 479
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Where did you put them? 1983 110 automatic OM606
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2nd Jan 2025 4:57pm |
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| tommobot Member Since: 15 May 2018 Location: Stratford Upon Avon Posts: 27
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Couple of comments,.... Id be very interested in which EWP you have used, as all of the UK ones I found were only viable if mechanical pump removed...
Although as long as they were triggered to come on at the temp the stat opens 'in theory', should be ok? Second point, was that everything I read about adding speed holes to the bonnet seemed to add temp, so again very interested to see! Don't mind hacking about bodywork to add a vent or two if it works!! |
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2nd Jan 2025 5:50pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088
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I had three holes down the outside rear curve to wings. It reduced heat in my case. I assume allowing the heat somewhere to go when pushed back by viscous. Note though that it was a vehicle used predominantly off road, although road legal it only drove on the road to and from events.
Ewp - Carl Davis. Is a through pump so mech pump will.pump past it when it's not working. When it's on it increases flow rate and pushes past mech pump is my understanding. Instructions readily available online give several fitment options including removing or leaving the mech pump in situ. The simplisy thing would be to get a billet water pump pulley made, dia to suit required flow Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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2nd Jan 2025 6:44pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088
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 Click image to enlarge Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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2nd Jan 2025 6:47pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8088
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On my 184 m57 I have fitted a small aux pump in the heater loop, this with modified stat keeps temps around 80 to 85 at head
Edited to add aux pumpmis 40lmin Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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2nd Jan 2025 8:15pm |
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| Doby92 Member Since: 01 Jan 2025 Location: Mackay Posts: 4
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Took it up the hill that caused it to get to 110 deg c at lunchtime today, temp a bit cooler at 29c.
No Thermostat Electric fan on Start temp at bottom of steep section 92c Temp got up to 101c as I rounded the last switch back before the last 1km ramp at 12-15% Pushed it harder to see what would happen Temp got to 104c and thats the fastest I been up that section in any 4wd I have owned. Turn around at the top locked it in 2nd gear and descended to the bottom, temp came down to 75c. I turned the fan off half way down as it was below the switch on temp. Temp measurement taken from a multi function display that is wired into CAN and OBD2 scan gauge. Both are getting the same data from the same sensor and were within a degree of each other. |
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3rd Jan 2025 4:36am |
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