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neirbossor



Member Since: 10 Jun 2021
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 23

Scotland 2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Bonatti Grey
Starting issues
sigh...not having a good time with the 2.4 Puma at the moment, still grappling with the coolant issue and now I have starting problems (pretty sure they are not related).

Anyway, my issue is turn the ignition to position 1, let the glow plug light go out, move to start position, hear the starter sov clunk, dash lights go out and nothing else happens. If I keep flicking the key on and off eventaully it goes but seems to be getting worse.

I'm assuming that if the SOV is activating then the actual starter circuit is ok, what else..knackered starter? Battery seems ok, voltage is 11-12 volts at position 1.
Post #1018752 19th Dec 2023 5:15pm
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MK



Member Since: 28 Aug 2008
Location: Santiago
Posts: 2408

Chile 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Chawton White
Check ground connections at the chassis and transfer case.

Check voltaje drop while cranking it. Puma 110" SW

.............................................................
Earth first. Other planets later
Post #1018755 19th Dec 2023 5:27pm
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ickle



Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: South Vendee
Posts: 1776

France 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Alpine White
IIRC you are using / losing a lot of coolant, please make sure its not seeping into the cylinder and its hydraulically locking - possibly disconnect the injectors and remove the glow plugs then crank it over?
Or maybe just check its not steaming out of the exhaust when running

Perhaps one of the very knowledgeable peeps on here can advise better / further?

HTH Keith
Post #1018763 19th Dec 2023 7:00pm
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BaronDefenders



Member Since: 28 Jun 2019
Location: London/Cotswolds
Posts: 895

United Kingdom 2004 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Santorini Black
Could be a faulty starter.

The starter on our 2.2 failed recently. The only warning it gave was it failed to turn over in a car park in the summer, but was fine on the second attempt. A few weeks later I went to drive it and the click from the solenoid was all that happened, nothing else. No matter how many times I cycled the ignition or struck the starter with a hammer, it would not spin over.

A new starter resolved the issue. Charlie

1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD)
2002 Td5 90 (SOLD)
2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD)

1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored)
1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE)
2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK)
2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build)

Instagram: @BaronDefenders
Post #1018795 20th Dec 2023 9:07am
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17320

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
Re: Starting issues
neirbossor wrote:
...
Anyway, my issue is turn the ignition to position 1, let the glow plug light go out, move to start position, hear the starter sov clunk, dash lights go out and nothing else happens. If I keep flicking the key on and off eventually it goes but seems to be getting worse.
...


This does seem to be a Puma "thing". All the time since I bought mine, it has randomly and fairly infrequently behaved as though it has a nearly flat battery. It would either crank incredibly slowly or juct click and not crank. Leave it a few minutes and it would be fine, all very strange. Eventually is started to get more frequent, so I replaced both the battery and the starter and for a few months everything was fine. Now it is starting to do exactly the same thing again.

The two relays involved in the started circuit have also been replaced, and the earth connections on my Defender are exceptionally good (I beefed them all up when I fitted the winch (all the major components are earthed with 50mm^2 copper with two separate connections to the battery).

I can't see that it is a switch issue since the switch must be energising the starter relay, and I can only conclude that it is a solenoid issue and I am just unlucky in having the (new genuine) starter begin to mimic the old starter after such a short time. Sad
Post #1018803 20th Dec 2023 10:13am
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MK



Member Since: 28 Aug 2008
Location: Santiago
Posts: 2408

Chile 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Chawton White
Same here, although original starter and new battery. Locking and unlocking does the trick, however I do not really understand how it is related, if at all. Puma 110" SW

.............................................................
Earth first. Other planets later
Post #1018804 20th Dec 2023 10:19am
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neirbossor



Member Since: 10 Jun 2021
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 23

Scotland 2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Bonatti Grey
Its a strange fault, started no problem today but last night I took the bins down to the bottom of the road and it refused to start, much punching and swearing involved and it finally sprung to life. I have a suspected head leak as well so starting issue has gone down the list of worries.
Post #1018846 20th Dec 2023 5:58pm
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neirbossor



Member Since: 10 Jun 2021
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 23

Scotland 2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Bonatti Grey
[Above coolant issue resolved and starter/main relays changed out]

Went to start it today and it started on first turn of the key. It then stalled and wouldn't re-start (it was cranking fine). I eventually got it going but it was super lumpy, a bit of knocking and the accelerator was unresponsive, I kept it running and once warmed up was totally fine. No DTC codes picked up, does this sound like classic VCV? I have ordered one anyway just as a precaution.
Post #1020693 10th Jan 2024 9:48am
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neirbossor



Member Since: 10 Jun 2021
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 23

Scotland 2009 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 HT Bonatti Grey
Changed the ignition barrel switch and seems to have solved the intermittent starting issue! by some stroke of luck it looks like the previous owner had already changed it at some point as the bolts had already been drilled out and replaced with cap heads. First luck i've had since I took ownership, I was all ready to start ripping the dash out till I realised.

Also purchased a new VCV, sitting in a box in the garage, just trying to summon the will to change it now.
Post #1021291 15th Jan 2024 3:52pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20283

United Kingdom 
Sounds like the battery voltage was too low - how old is it? It should be at 12.6v at rest.
It shouldn’t go too low except for actual cranking. (Which on cranking a 9v dip could be expected).
Is the battery clamps tight?
When it’s running the alternator should be putting out at least 13.8v to 14.8v to ensure a proper battery charge.

Usually these things are a loose connection, especially main ground, loose battery clamps or a failed or failing battery.
These have been the issues I’ve had, not had any probables with the starter or ignition at all.
A bad VCV can make starting not so good, and harder to crank but normally causes cutting out once running but it can be part of it.
When mine went it would start but cut out not long after, rough idle / Rev hunting is a good sign of a failing VCV and lack of power in 5th or 6th gear.

So yes, VCV is a good starting point and see how it goes, but keep an eye on the battery voltage especially if it’s many years old.
If the battery voltage keeps sinking low at rest by its self then that might be a sign to get a new one.
Worth checking for parasitic load too and moisture in light fittings, anything over 60mA current at rest I’d say is rather unusual.
If it exceeds 120mA then I’d definitely look at parasitic load via a constant live circuit.

I have had water get into the interior light fitting drawing a small current draw between the contacts draining the batttery, then causing further issues from that, and not easy to find either.
I dried it out, used a little silicon grease on the tracks contacts and then put it back.

After all the wet weather you never know.

I guess a new non genuine interior light fitting may be a better option, though I’ve only had it happen once. The difficulty is, it’s not easy to find it as being the culprit but it will draw the battery capacity down…

Good luck. Thumbs Up ⭐️⭐️God Bless the USA 🇬🇧🇺🇸 ⭐️⭐️
Post #1021319 15th Jan 2024 8:06pm
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