 | Home > Off Topic > JLR sued 2 pensioner enthusiasts for copyright infringements |
 
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5804   
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‘Selling £1 Million "official" replicas isn't the way to save JLR. Building current vehicles people want to buy, at an affordable price, would be a good start.’
Couldn’t agree more. When Gerry became design chief, it was obvious LR were going to move ever further away from their core buyer. Why couldn’t they have had two chief designers, one each for the Land and Range divisions? In the last decade they’ve morphed into one: in look, in price, in predicted usage, in target market. And now they’re choosing to use old models, (including as we’ve seen elsewhere, the only five year old Tdci- Puma), to create ultra high price gimmicks for more of their new target market to buy. When I buy LR (ahem  ) first thing I’ll do is split the company clearly between divisions and get an engineer to head the ‘Land’ arm of the company. Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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12th Feb 2021 7:46am |
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| jerseyman Member Since: 21 Jul 2009 Location: Jersey Posts: 279 |
Despite the hype, it was not two old guys making a Jag, but two old guys building a prototype prior to setting up a production run of quarter-million pound replicas. |
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12th Feb 2021 5:21pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018  
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If the facts are important... I don't think it was two old guys...
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12th Feb 2021 6:27pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17359 
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Not according to the daughter of the couple involved (only one of whom was a guy, by the way). |
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12th Feb 2021 7:37pm |
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| jerseyman Member Since: 21 Jul 2009 Location: Jersey Posts: 279 |
This a quote from another board on this subject.
"..... read through some of the Court proceedings. it seems the company 'Creare Form AB' were creating and promoting a C Type copies under the name Authenticat. The original one had been sold by Creare Form to Karl Magnusson (owner of the company). It had then been displayed in public, and marketing produced for sale of subsequent models. Some employees of JLR had been liaising with Karl with drawings and design since 2006 on the belief that he was creating a one off, personal replica, not that he was creating a number of copies for commercial reasons. So it seems that if you want to build your own one off copy, not a problem. If you want to produce and sell copies, then JLR will come after you." |
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13th Feb 2021 12:05am |
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| Oldyellar Member Since: 04 Sep 2015 Location: Central Posts: 384  
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First I've heard  |
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13th Feb 2021 12:16am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Rather than quote from another board, why not read the Court proceedings yourself? Was it that board that told you it was 2 guys? |
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13th Feb 2021 6:41am |
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5804
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^^^ Also a ‘production run’ of two. Not sure that even qualifies.
I thought about this a little more last night and why JLR might have done it and I can only see one reason. Whilst someone willing and able to spend millions on a car will absolutely understand ‘provenance’, and so wouldn’t entertain buying a replica - even a very good one - at a price most people couldn’t afford, you aren’t normally über-wealthy because you’re a fool. Whilst some inherit fortunes and can open themselves up to ‘a fool and their money are easily parted’, most of the world’s UHNW are self made. What’s more, they’re not buying the latest, brand new McClaren painted in tango orange as a mere fashion statement, they’re buying a C-type because they’re likely a car-nut, an aficionado. As such, they’ll have some savvy, do some research and understand what’s going in to the creation of these ‘official’ replicas. And they will learn, as seems clear from specialist forums, just how little of this car is being actually made in house by Jag and just how much is being outsourced. Given it’s the vast majority of the car and indeed much of what matters (notably engine, panels etc), maybe - whilst not wanting to buy the Creare replica - they will want to know it can be built of the same stuff and sold for a fraction of the price that Jag want, when the only difference is exactly where it was assembled and that it has an authentic chassis number. This would then make them wonder why they’re buying it at all. Interestingly, in trying to get rid of a replica/manufacturer and hide the ‘real’ value of the Jag C-type, they have instead just highlighted it. I wonder how this will impact the sales of their C-Type and any future projects where they plan to use up the last few chassis on a period production run. Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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13th Feb 2021 7:06am |
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| LiftedDisco Member Since: 17 Aug 2014 Location: Towcester Posts: 352 
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Letter issued by Dan Pink on 11th Feb:
To the Jaguar community, You may have seen a recent news story relating to a C-type replica which portrays Jaguar Cars negatively, after a Swedish court ruled in our favour confirming that the C-type is protected by copyright. We wanted to reassure our customers and loyal enthusiasts that most of this news release was misleading, conjecture or completely untrue. At Jaguar Land Rover we wholeheartedly value our communities’ continued support. Importantly, we want to allay any fears amongst the network of enthusiasts that Jaguar Land Rover might pursue individual owners of replica Jaguars and insist upon their destruction. This is not true. We will however, take action to stop businesses using our Intellectual Property illegally for their own profit, as in this case. The Swedish court’s decision in our favour confirms that we were correct to take this case forward. According to the Swedish court, the external shape of the Jaguar C-type is protected by copyright, and this was infringed by a car being built by the defendants’ company, the first of six that they planned to build and sell at over Euros 250 thousand each. At Jaguar Land Rover we understand that original C-types and official continuations are attainable for only a few and would like to be enjoyed by more enthusiasts. We have never, nor would we, take action against private owners of pre-existing individual replica vehicles, nor insist upon the destruction of their cars. In this case Jaguar Land Rover offered the defendants an opportunity to retain their completed replica for private use and enjoyment, however this was declined, and the defendants chose to continue with their plans to make money from our copyright. The enthusiasm of our fans and the celebration of our heritage is extremely important to JaguarLand Rover. We will do everything we can to safeguard our heritage and it’s to honour this commitment that Jaguar Land Rover Classic was established in 2017. Dedicated to the production, restoration and maintenance of historic models, as well as the manufacture of new parts, Jaguar Land Rover Classic ensures that enthusiasts can enjoy our vehicles long into the future. Jaguar Land Rover Classic preserve cars of historic significance and collections, we train talented technicians in specialist methods to build and maintain these special vehicles, ensuring traditional skills do not disappear, and work with owner groups around the world. When restrictions are lifted Jaguar Land Rover Classic will once again open the doors of its world class facilities for enthusiasts to enjoy. We thank you for your ongoing support. Yours sincerely Dan Pink Director, Jaguar Land Rover Classic on behalf of Jaguar Land Rover |
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13th Feb 2021 4:42pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Can you link the source please?
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13th Feb 2021 5:39pm |
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| LiftedDisco Member Since: 17 Aug 2014 Location: Towcester Posts: 352
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And a translation of initial elements of the Court Judgement - bearing in mind that this is a Patent issue and not just any old case... points 1 and 4 both reference multiple vehicles and it’s pretty clear from the overall judgement (there’s 196 pages in all..) that this was a commercial operation (potentially) and not just a hobby garage set up...
Dok.Id 2262425 Address Box 8307 104 20 Stockholm Besöksadress City Hall, Scheelegatan 7 Telephone Fax Expeditionstid 08- 561 654 70 E- måndag – fredag post: 08:00–16:00 stockholms.tingsratt.patentmarknad@dom.se www.stockholmstingsratt.se STOCKHOLM DISTRICT COURT Dom PMT 15833-18 Patent and Market Court 2020-12-11 1. The Patent and Market Court prohibits Creare Form AB, Ann-Christine Magnusson and Karl Magnusson, in the event of a penalty of SEK 1,000,000, from producing specimens of the Jaguar C-type car model according to the court's alaw A-D and it available to the public by displaying it publicly. 2. The Patent and Market Court finds that Creare Form AB, Ann-Christine Magnusson and Karl Magnusson are jointly and severally obliged to pay fair compensation under Chapter 7. 54 of the Copyright Act for the models of the Jaguar C- type car model in Appendix A-D and for making available tothe public by public display of the petition in AppendixA. 3. The Patent and Market Court orders the destruction of the jaguar ctype models listed in Annex A-D, at the defendants' expense. However, in the case of the specimen in domsbilaga A, a Jaguar C-type replica, only the body of the car is the body. 4. The Patent and Market Court prohibits Creare Form AB, Ann-Christine Magnusson and Karl Magnusson, in the event of a penalty of SEK 1,000,000, from taking up a position with the two chassis and the component stockpurchased by Creare Form AB to produce copies of the Jaguar C-type car model. 5. The Patent and Market Court orders Creare Form AB, Ann-Christine Magnusson and Karl Magnusson to jointly and severally reimburse Jaguar Land Rover Limited for itslegal costs of SEK 4,994,863, together with interest under Section 6 of the Interest Act (1975:635) from that date until payment is made. Of this amount, SEK 4,619,743 is about agent fees. There is far more, but this gives an accurate flavour.. hopefully... Link to full document here if you need: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bTbbwIerQ...zc-C3vNHvU |
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13th Feb 2021 5:58pm |
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| LiftedDisco Member Since: 17 Aug 2014 Location: Towcester Posts: 352
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Yep - open letter shared by Jaguar Enthusiasts’ Club: https://jec.org.uk/news/2021/jaguar-land-r...g-replicas |
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13th Feb 2021 6:04pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Thank you.
I'm struggling with the logic that these cars had to be destroyed to preserve their IP but other replica cars don't? |
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14th Feb 2021 7:15am |
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5804
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Interesting. I wonder when Jag registered the design, whether with the Swedish authorities or Europe? The Swedish IP office and laws follow European law, where design IP rights are limited to 25 years. UK I believe is 20 years. So Jag must have registered these designs fairly recently. Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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14th Feb 2021 7:27am |
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