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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I have a question to put out there and wondered if there were any MOT testers on the forum who might be able to give me an opinion.
I haven't been in touch with the dealer yet because I want to get as much information together as possible before I approach them. A vehicle in the Grafton fleet has recently passed an MOT (at the dealership). The service manager, at handover, said that the front subframe on the vehicle was heavily corroded (with a hole) but not badly enough to fail. It was noted as an advisory on the MOT. My dad was concerned about the rust and asked me to treat it all before they salt the roads to stop it getting worse. Today I put the vehicle on our ramp and was quite surprised to see a hole about the size of a 50p piece about 150mm away from the lower wishbone mount ![]() I was under the impression that any corrosion that weakened the vehicle structure to the point there was a hole (within 30cm of brakes, suspension, seatbelts etc) was an MOT failure? If this is the case then the only reason I can think of that they passed it was that the vehicle is still under warranty AND has the extra MOT failure warranty that covers any failure items under the extra warranty plan. What also concerns me is that the heat shield that protects the centre prop bearing had been torn and bent out of the way (now resting against the exhaust) to inspect the central bearing to investigate an odd noise under acceleration. This isn't the kind of service I'd be expecting from a main dealer. If anyone is able to help I could PM a picture of the corrosion. Thanks in advance ![]() 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3564 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I am not an MOT Tester Grafty, but that is how I understand corrosion is checked during an MOT.
Seems strange that the Dealer realised the corrosion was there. That would be the first place to check during the test? |
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excossack Member Since: 22 Feb 2012 Location: North West Posts: 5884 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
With the car being under warranty, wouldn't a new subframe be in order & paid for by the dealer? 1999 Defender TD5 110
Regards John M0VAZ Econet Station 48 no clock |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Yes! That's my point. The warranty only covers MOT failure and I think they've advised to avoid paying out.
Direct from the government website ![]() Click image to enlarge 2002 90 Td5 Station Wagon 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
This is taken from the MOT handbook (all found online so probably have to be taken with a pinch of salt)
Corrosion and prescribed areas. The Mot Tester’s manual,appendix C describes a prescribed area. “Certain areas of the vehicle structure are particularly important for the safety of a vehicle. Particular attention must be paid to these areas during an inspection. These areas are: · The load bearing parts of the vehicle to which the testable items defined in Sections 2, 3 and 5 of the Inspection Manual are mounted, and any load bearing or supporting structure or supporting panelling within 30cm of the mounting location.” Sections 2,3 and 5 refer to steering and suspension, brakes and seatbelts. Excessive corrosion is described as · The corrosion has caused a hole in the metal, or · it is weakened to the extent that by finger and thumb pressure it does not feel sound, or · finger and thumb pressure or use of the Corrosion Assessment Tool causes a hole. As I'm not an MOT tester I don't know. But from the way I read that, there is no grey area. It should have failed. This line in particular Excessive corrosion is described as · The corrosion has caused a hole in the metal I'll pop into our usual garage for the rest of our vehicles and see what they say ![]() 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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Procta Member Since: 03 Dec 2016 Location: Sunderland Posts: 5235 ![]() ![]() |
I wouldn't go to a main dealer at all, grafty I have had a dealer mot tester fiddle with my rear number plate lights to make them fail. it never went back to Peugeot again, and I only did business with them as a very last resort, after that. If they passed it, I recon they wanted to wriggle out of sorting it out for the warranty. Pass it and its out of our hands sort of speak, Sometimes warranties are not really worth the paper. Defender TD5 90 ---/--- Peugeot 306 HDI hatch back Success is 90% Inspiration and 4 minutes Preparation # you can make it! |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I wouldn't either, except its still under warranty and my parents like to convince of everything in one place. As soon as the warranty expires (just before the next MOT as it happens
![]() ![]() 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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Procta Member Since: 03 Dec 2016 Location: Sunderland Posts: 5235 ![]() ![]() |
yeah that's true, as i say i think they just passed it so they didn't have to deal with it on the warranty side of things. Since my dads last MOT at his " favourite place" He will be doing his servicing now rather than them doing it. What a joke of a mot that was! Defender TD5 90 ---/--- Peugeot 306 HDI hatch back
Success is 90% Inspiration and 4 minutes Preparation # you can make it! |
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excossack Member Since: 22 Feb 2012 Location: North West Posts: 5884 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I think would approach the main dealer direct (not the garage but HQ and see if this is covered under the corrosion warranty of the car) and they can foot the bill etc for swapping out. 1999 Defender TD5 110 Regards John M0VAZ Econet Station 48 no clock |
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Mash Member Since: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Guernsey Posts: 1674 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I used to inspect vehicles to a slightly different standard but based on Vosa guidance.
Any corrosion within 30cm of a structural mounting point was deemed a fail, there is a proper approved corrosion inspection hammer too. Reading the corrosion you have would of resulted in a fail as the subframe is part of the structure, if it had been a skid/bash plate bolted onto the subframe it would be an advisory. Would pictures be possible Grafty? 90 wolf - Jasmin http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic39408.html 90 V8 - Maggie http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic42564.html 110 TD5 - Buggsy http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic59029.html 52HG25 lightweight https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic72342.html D3 Hse - Fiona Capri 2l S - Anna Think I might have a problem............ |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Yeah, can't do any harm I suppose.
As you can see, well within 30cm of the lower wishbone mount ![]() ![]() Click image to enlarge 2002 90 Td5 Station Wagon 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
In fact, the flash on the camera has picked out a hole on the other side by the looks of it.... 2002 90 Td5 Station Wagon
1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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gilarion Member Since: 05 Dec 2013 Location: Wales Posts: 5115 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Graffty99 you are not on your own,
These are pictures of a chassis on a 1984 90 that passed its MOT a few years ago. A few months later I booked this 90 in for an exhaust replacement at Land Ranger and they informed me that if I were to tow a heavy fully loaded trailer the back of the chassis would snap off. Ended up having a chassis swap. ![]() Click image to enlarge For those who like Welsh Mountains and narrow boats have a look at my videos and photos at.. http://www.youtube.com/user/conwy1 |
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grafty99 Member Since: 15 Aug 2012 Location: North Devon Posts: 4795 ![]() ![]() ![]() |
![]() 1990 Vogue SE Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200 Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton |
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