 | Home > Technical > Transfer box jumps out of High range after being used in low |
 
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848  
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On a roll today... two questions inside 10 mintues.
I've a mate who lives down a farm track/forestry road. It's not too bad, but it's steep in places so to be nice to my car, and to the track I tend to pop the car into Low Range for the trip down and back. Maybe a mile, downhill to the house; a mile uphill back to the tarmac road. Now when I try and slot the car back into High Range at the top of the track it just jumps out. I think the problem is compounded by the fact that the first two or three miles on tarmac are narrow, and downhill so I'm doing little more than coasting, in gear, but with no great 'drive' going trhough the transmission. Eventually, after 7 or 8 attempts it will go into High and will stay there indefinitely. Usually at the bottom of the hill when I start to put more 'drive' through the transmission.... until I next want to use Low Range. It's my original LT230 transfer box. Recently rebuilt with HD this and that, and an ATB centre. I haven't yet removed the transmission tunnel (one of my 'pet hate' jobs because I have Wright accoustic matting in place and need to take so much out of the car to get to the stage where I can remove the tunnel easily). On the basis that it's a fresh and reputable rebuild, and because "Once it's in, it stays in" I'm assuming there's going to be no issue with the box itself. Should I be looking at the linkages? When we put the car back together after the boxes went back in, I noticed that the H/L & Diff lock linkages had lots of slack and worn bushes etc. But I needed the car back together for a two week holiday, so just had to go with it. I've now got the new bushes, rods, clips etc but was going to leave them 'for a rainy day'. I have searched the web and found a few like this, and the advice is often: stick it in gear, ease the clutch up, and see if the transfer lever will notch in a little further. Trying this, but the lever does not come any further back. Any wise words? Ta Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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16th Aug 2021 2:27pm |
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| geobloke Member Since: 06 Nov 2012 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 4410 
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How irritating, but yes you are going to have to pull out the transmission tunnel. It sounds like your High Low lever is out by a tooth (maybe two) so when you push in to high the lever isn't moving the linkage quite far enough.
Mark the position of the linkage on the star cog. Remove the locking bolt. Pull of the linkage. Refit one tooth anti-clockwise. Replace locking bolt. Go for a drive to test it works. If not try two teeth. Whilst you are there grease up the linkages. I take it your diff-lock is engaging and the light is coming on? If not then this is the time to sort that out as well. How do you find the ATB centre? High up on my mods wish list  |
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16th Aug 2021 5:02pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848
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Thanks Geobloke,
I don't remember the splined collar being removed, but I guess it will need adjusted having gone from operating a 230k mile box to a '0' mile box. It will be a chance to put all the new stuff in place anyway and tighten things up. I'm glad though to have that suggestion confirmed before I start tearing stuff apart to find there was another 'easy fix' out there somewhere. Hey ho. On the ATB I wish I could say I've noticed it - which might be a good thing too. The rebuilt box was fitted only a month ago and apart from my mate's farm track it's all been tarmac since then. I might have noticed the car was much better behaved when in wet road conditions (motorway, or fast dual c'way during thunderstorms). In the past I've had some scary moments in situations like that, recently not a thing - but I could be imagining that too. The medium term plan is for longer 'exped' trips in Europe - Pyrenees, Portugal and it's a 'peace of mind' thing for me. Made sense to get it done while the box was out. I might even venture south of the border and try out some of your 'green lanes'. There's an ATB in the rear axle; and there's one sitting waiting for when I rebuild the front axle later this year. Of more dramatic impact is the Roamerdrive - but that's a whole other story! I plan to write that up in my 'rebuild' thread when I can find the time. Edit - as a PS - I'm not 100% sure about difflock either. Is it on, or is it just that the light's not working...? But this is the one where the linkage really was past its best. Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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16th Aug 2021 5:21pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848
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User error is certainly possible! Though to be fair to myself, it didn't used to do this, and I've had it into low box more than once or twice over the years.
Not fully engaging - so I'll pull it into H, put the main box in gear, ease up on the clutch and see if the transfer lever will drop further back. Not getting any real success at that. When it 'works' and stays in, I can't say that it feels any different to all the other times it doesn't. Which gear is the main box in when I try shifting into H range - probably neutral most of the time. I think I'd stop; put the main box into neutral; clutch pedal down; pull back the transfer lever; slot the main box into gear; try and move off. It's at this point that the lever just nudges forward. Not sure what you mean about checking the position once it's in low, or what LRE style means? To be honest I don't think I do check it. It goes into low easy enough, no issues, so I just get on with driving along. Just in case any of that comes across as overly defensive, it's 100% not meant to be. QUite happy to consider that it could be poor technique on my part. As far as the linkages are concerned, when the boxes went in I did think there was quite a lot of wear and slop, so it wouldn't do any harm, but if there's something else I should be doing on the change, then happy to hear it. Edit - sorry _ I probably misread your reply James. When it goes into LOW, the main box will be neutral. It's getting and staying in HIGH is the issue. Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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16th Aug 2021 7:23pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8097 
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Always do a range change engine running gbox in any gear, clutch pedal down.. Foot on brake , hand brake off. Apply pressure fwd or back as required to transfer lever, when resistance is felt keep applying pressure and slowly lift clutch pedal towards biting point. Foot still on foot brake. Lever will either then continue in direction pressure is being applied, or vehicle will try to start moving, the latter showing its positively engaged. On either outcome depress clutch again. If former was outcome then repeat exercise to ensure lever is fully home and takes load. This is lre way.
Your symptoms sound like partial engagement which then results in it coming out during light load, eg coasting, over run. Or, there is linkage issues but that's unlikely with puma setup I would of thought Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop Last edited by jst on 17th Aug 2021 8:25pm. Edited 2 times in total |
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17th Aug 2021 2:48pm |
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| boxoftricks Member Since: 06 Feb 2019 Location: Home Counties Posts: 747 
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What jst is saying. Sounds like partial engagement.
Also to help preserve your drive train when in low ratio and pulling away in first or second always pre-load the drive train rather than just pulling away, it takes up any slack and stops wear. |
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17th Aug 2021 4:13pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848
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Thanks guys - that gives me something to work with.
JST - thanks for taking the time. Will practice that. Quick follow up though - you said that linkage issues are unlikely with a Puma. We're actually talking about a 27 y/o Tdi linkage here. As far as I know, while the boxes have been changed (4 times in total, allowing for refurbs that needed/wanted attention) the original linkages have just been reattached to the new boxes. I doubt they've been as heavily used as your vehicles, but still, they've been hanging about underneath a LR for over 25 years. As I have the parts now, I will change them just to eliminate worn parts. I'll then go out and work with your recommendations. Boxoftricks - can you clarify what you mean by preload? Careful clutch use to take up slack? Thanks again gents. Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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17th Aug 2021 10:15pm |
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| geobloke Member Since: 06 Nov 2012 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 4410
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Hi donmacn. I believe that boxotricks means: When in Low go slow. Gently in, gently out with the clutch pedal. Let the drive train take up the slack in the system before planting the go pedal. |
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18th Aug 2021 1:51pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848
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^^ thanks Geo. that makes sense - and is what I would do anyway. Whenever I've used low box it's not really the place for a heavy foot, and I think I'm pretty mechanically sympathetic overall. I mean, if it breaks, it's me who gets stranded and has to fix it! Donald
1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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18th Aug 2021 2:15pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8097
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Sorry I assumed tdci linkage era. The adjustment on tdci variants is far better as are end fittings with ball sockets. I would certainly check all parts are still there, especially the small nylon 2 piece bushes Cheers
James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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18th Aug 2021 3:27pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1848
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Thanks JST.
I'm pretty sure almost all of it's there - just old and in some instances pretty worn. I didn't realise it had all been improved for later vehicles. Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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18th Aug 2021 4:04pm |
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| Horneteer Member Since: 10 Feb 2015 Location: Cornwall Posts: 60 
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Hi donmacn
I had a similar issue but it wouldn't stay in low, I found it was the selector mechanism in the transfer box as per this video by Britannica Restorations at about 3:30. Do you have a slightly wobbly Hi-Low lever as that was the giveaway with mine, now there's no freeplay and perfect shifting. &t=212s |
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22nd Aug 2021 8:40pm |
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