 | Home > Technical > How to properly change the rear crank seal on a TDCI |
 
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| Leamreject Member Since: 19 Dec 2020 Location: Middle Earth - Leamington Spa Posts: 970   
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Could it by chance be gear oil from a failing gearbox input shaft?
Gear oil has a very distinctive smell. Ride like you stole it!! If I’m not on a bike it’s because only a 4x4 will do… 2011 2.4 Puma 90 HT |
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16th Apr 2021 6:24pm |
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| Dinnu Member Since: 24 Dec 2019 Location: Lija Posts: 3446  
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Sorry to hear that... must be frustrating.
Assuming the diagnosis is correct and it is the crank seal that is the culprit, frankly speaking I do not know how you could see anything if you get the engine running with the gearbox removed. The seal is behind the flywheel, and the flywheel is for sure needed (to start, sensor but most importantly, inertia). If the crank is worn, which I hope not at 80kkm, then the installer should have noticed it. The seal itself, unlike old designs consist of an aluminium casting with the seal itself. The casting should make a seal with the engine block as well, plus the lip seal against the crank. Could it be that it is leaking between the seal casting and the engine block?? The seal also comes with an installation 'thingy'. It is important not to remove this plastic thingy before the seal is installed. The crank will push it out when the seal is being installed. This is important as the seal lip is facing inwards, and failure to keep the plastic ring in place during installation might damage the seal and get it trapped and not seal correctly. The seal design (lip on crank) is such that if the crank case pressure is higher, the pressure itself will force the seal to seal even more. I cannot remember if the seal has a garter ring around it, but most probably. When installing seals, it is also beneficial to add grease between the outer and inner seal (most seals come pre greased. This helps improving the lifetime of the seal. 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing 2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black |
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16th Apr 2021 6:24pm |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686  
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Thanks guys. It’s not gearbox oil, the crank seal was wet with oil and that face of the engine had the tell tale on it. Gearbox side was dry. I don’t see the point of taking the gearbox off again and fitting a third seal without a different plan? Have had a good chat with my mechanic and we agreed that we need a beer and a good think!
How much is an M57 swap going to set me back, or an LS3?!! |
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16th Apr 2021 6:36pm |
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| Race.it Member Since: 27 Aug 2019 Location: Algeciras Posts: 826  
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Mike on británica rest YouTube had that issue in one vídeo think end result was after installing it expanded if left alone and sealed, he did a smoke test etc maybe that’s it but I I know it’s a tdci he was prob on a tdi Searching for my first Defender...and started just as Covid hit, so talk about timing.
5 months after starting the search I found it, and here is the details |
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16th Apr 2021 6:41pm |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686
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So you think it may bed in? That would be a result!!
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16th Apr 2021 6:50pm |
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| Dinnu Member Since: 24 Dec 2019 Location: Lija Posts: 3446
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How bad is the oil leak?
It is possible that the seal 'beds in', but is not very normal. Seals should work right at time = 0. Did you inspect the previous oil seals perhaps they give you a clue? 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing 2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black |
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16th Apr 2021 7:04pm |
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| Race.it Member Since: 27 Aug 2019 Location: Algeciras Posts: 826
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Think this was the vid or one before/after Searching for my first Defender...and started just as Covid hit, so talk about timing. 5 months after starting the search I found it, and here is the details |
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16th Apr 2021 7:39pm |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686
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That’s a really great point Dinnu, I’ll give them a bell Monday and hopefully they still have the old seal.
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16th Apr 2021 7:42pm |
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| Scotm Member Since: 28 Feb 2014 Location: Aberdeenshire Posts: 671  
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I had similar leak fixed under warranty a few years ago. It took them a couple of attempts - first they fitted a new slave cylinder and clutch. The second time involved changing Rear Crank Oil Seal, Gaskets for Upper and lower sump and Front timing casing.
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17th Apr 2021 5:59am |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686
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Did a bit of a blot test to see if I had oil and fuel in the leak but I don’t, only oil. Would that rule out injectors?
 Click image to enlarge |
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17th Apr 2021 8:42am |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686
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Spoke to mechanic today. There were no marks on the old seal; visibly it was in good condition. He used the white plastic fitting tool as intended so no issue there. Not sure where this leaves me? Damaged face on the crank itself? Leak from the crank case to the ladder section below? If it’s the latter that looks like a
 of a job? |
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19th Apr 2021 5:59pm |
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| Dinnu Member Since: 24 Dec 2019 Location: Lija Posts: 3446
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Yeah, I find it strange that the oil seal replaced 3 times and all went wrong! As you suspect, maybe leaking from somwhere else that makes it look like as if it is the crank seal. I do not have enough knowledge on the tdci to suggest from where though. 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing
2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black |
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19th Apr 2021 7:00pm |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3686
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There is a seal along what is called the ladder section on a 2.4, or the skirt stiffener on the 2.2 but it’s essentially the same thing. It is component 1 on the diagram below. As far as I can tell, it means removing the gearbox from the rear, removing the auxiliary belt and timing cover from the front, removing the sump to remove the oil pump and then remove the skirt stiffener and renew the gasket.
I’m genuinely getting to the stage where it is going to be getting that expensive I’m considering a different engine. If I do this I don’t expect much change from a grand and a risk that still it leaks. Thoughts?! Click image to enlarge |
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19th Apr 2021 7:07pm |
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| Shroppy Member Since: 25 Feb 2016 Location: Shropshire Posts: 866 
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I can't speak from experience having only worked on the earlier engines but, what make are the seals that have been fitted and failed?
As discussed above, I've never known a seal to 'bed in' other than some leather type seals that need to be presoaked with oil. I would hope that the mechanic fitting the seal would have noticed any scoring/damage to the crank, or the block itself but wouldn't rule it out. I'm not suggesting the mechanics are anything other than excellent but there is no substitute for seeing it with your own eyes in my experience. 1985 127 V8 Build Thread Series 2 109" Series 1 80" |
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19th Apr 2021 8:54pm |
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