 | Home > Off Topic > Winch Blanket Advice! |
 
|
|
|
| Zagato Site Supporter Member Since: 08 Jan 2011 Location: Billingshurst West Sussex Posts: 5013  
|
Thanks for the comments,
 As you say the winch is rated to cope with 2-3 times the necessary pull (it's a biggy!) but have to agree it doesn't look brilliant strength wise  I'll look into Dyneema also which would be much better and maybe an electric winch will be the way forward eventually.  |
||
14th May 2012 5:34pm |
|
| cobs Member Since: 12 Jun 2008 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 336 
|
As others have mentioned back the trailer further in - you could probably go another 2-3 feet into the water without it coming anywhere near the hubs - remember it's the bearings you're trying to protect not the tyres! Backing further in would reduce the pull required - making it more of a straight pull onto the bilge keels.
Link to portable winch: http://www.dborc.co.uk/goodwinch/ you need to click on 'Portable winch in a box' |
||
|
14th May 2012 6:03pm |
|
| ay4alex Member Since: 18 Feb 2009 Location: Midlands Posts: 328 
|
In full agreement that dynaline is a better option for you considering the load. Come on Zag, get your feet wet!
 Click image to enlarge IMG_0195 by .:ay4alex:., on Flickr 110 Tdci Double Cab |
||
|
14th May 2012 6:43pm |
|
| Zagato Site Supporter Member Since: 08 Jan 2011 Location: Billingshurst West Sussex Posts: 5013
|
Thats good value  Thanks
The trailer is built bespoke to the boat and is very clever not having to wet the wheels and need of replacing bearings, messing about with rusting brakes, linkages etc. Been their done that with first two boats  It also straightens the boat as you pull it up between the bottom feeder wheels so you don't have to fart about pushing it around if you have a cross wind. The angle of pull is fine also, (it all pivots down flat of course before the whole weight of the boat is on it!) the boat weighs about 2200 LBs with engine, rigging, stores etc on board and is pulled up on hard rollers, the winch copes OK but if anything let go I would be toast but I have a solution now which won't involve a winch blanket which I think wouldn't be very effective.
Alex that's the way to do it 
You see people get in a right mess launching and recovering boats off Itchenor slip (not where I put mine in!), I've even seen the emergency services on a training exercise make a real hash of it at Itchenor. It's one of those tricky places where the slope can be slight at the wrong time so people drown their cars and trailers trying to get the boat on  Amuses the ever present crowd anyway Last edited by Zagato on 14th May 2012 7:25pm. Edited 4 times in total |
||
|
14th May 2012 7:16pm |
|
| Orange Member Since: 18 Apr 2012 Location: Sittingbourne, Kent Posts: 3  
|
The way I see it, you could bin the wrist-breaker winch with the following easy steps...
Step 1 - Tow bar on the front of the truck. Step 2 - synthetic winch rope on the front winch of the truck. Step 3 - U-shaped stainless hawse arrangement on the top of the post that the winch is mounted to. This would direct the rope to the correct height and angle for the trailer. Step 4 - winch boat onto trailer from the comfort of the drivers seat... ??? Maybe ??? |
||
|
14th May 2012 7:16pm |
|
| BigMike Member Since: 13 Jul 2010 Location: Lancashire Posts: 2253
|
Assuming the strap is rated correctly (and you say it is zag), then I can't see any reason at all to replace it. Obviously the more gradient there is on the pull equals more load on the strap so if you can get the winch at at lower angle there will be less load on the strap and winch. Also you're not lifting the whole weight of the boat, some is supported by water, and the last bit is pulling not lifting, so no need to worry or spend money unneccessarily really.
|
||
|
15th May 2012 8:15am |
|
| Zagato Site Supporter Member Since: 08 Jan 2011 Location: Billingshurst West Sussex Posts: 5013
|
Yes the winch and strap is well oversize as I needed it to be rated to pull the boat AND trailer up my drive around a corner by using a ground anchor. I am now storing it near Chichester Harbour to save all that hassle... |
||
|
15th May 2012 8:21am |
|
| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
|
I thought I'd posted this elsewhere, but can't find it, so apologies if this is effectively a double post on the OP's topic of winch blankets and the commercially available types that look like this:
Click image to enlarge I was struck by what the various Fire Brigades use as a winch blanket and how it differs quite dramatically from the norm in the off road world: Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge |
||
|
26th Nov 2019 5:33pm |
|
| sako243 Member Since: 08 Jul 2014 Location: Wales Posts: 1231  
|
Before you go spending any money it's worth taking a step back and (dare I say it) assessing the situation.
The way I see it there are three major points / categories of failure: a) The webbing breaks b) The winch mount / end breaks c) The boat end breaks If we look at a) then webbing in my experience tends to, as previous posters have mentioned, tend to go strand by strand (albeit sometimes quite quickly). If you look at my dinky little 1" straps that are TUV approved they still have a breaking strain of in excess of 5 tonnes. So you can reduce the chance of this failure by regularly checking the whole length of webbing over and ensuring it doesn't rub against anything. If we assume that the webbing is slightly elastic (can't tell from the picture) then if it snaps it will want to contract and therefore snap back towards the vehicle. However the webbing is relatively light and therefore the amount of energy it can impart is not huge (compared to point c below). So although it is a risk the chances of it doing damage are lower than other possibilities because webbing does not tend to be that elastic, it should have a substantial safety margin built in and by doing your checks above you've got confidence it's not severely weakened where it will suddenly snap. b) As this is a hand winch I would have thought that you'd notice you're putting a lot of effort in as you're winching it on and any failure is going to have some warning. Also given the loading on the winch then any failure of the winch mounting is going to cause the winch to be pulled towards the boat. Any sudden failure is likely down to poor maintenance on it (rusted bolts etc)., as I'd expect it to have had a significant safety factor designed in. You can also ensure that you are stood uphill / in front of the trailer (between it and the vehicle) when winching so that if something does go, yes you might need a change of underwear but shouldn't cause any significant harm to yourself. The mass of the winch and so on should also slow down any "projectile" nature of it. c) This is the one I'd be more concerned about and where the winch blanket comes into play. Lets assume that any breakage at this point will leave either the clevis on the strap (or worse the clevis and part of the boat) attached to it. As this is under strain then when that end lets go there is the potential for that end to come flying back towards the vehicle and winch person. So where I'd be placing a blanket / heavy jacket (bags clipped around it are also good) is around the heavy bits at that end of the webbing. Assuming the webbing is slightly elastic then as it's under load it storing up the potential energy and when the boat (lets say hull) gives way then the webbing will want to contract and cause the metal hook / clevis to come hurtling back doing lots of damage. By putting some extra mass around the clevis then you are absorbing some of that energy at the far end and hopefully preventing it from coming back to hit you. An interesting way that would also help mitigate this (which I've not seen done before, probably because of it's inconvenience and over-the-top in most situations) would be to attach a secondary line between the boat and the clevis / anchor point. If the primary point fails then the secondary rope (could in this situation be some appropriately rated climbing accessory cord / paracord for example) catches the heavy clevis and prevents it from hurtling back. This is performing the same function as the winch blanket but is less convenient. So after that long post my summary would be attach the blanket down near the boat. A secondary point is your suggestion of holding the line down towards the trailer - if you are distorting the straight line pull of the winch then you're introducing more problems because you're now adding something to rub against the strapping and changing the angle of the winch which might cause more issues (although based off that design I can't see it affecting it much). One possibility that you may not have considered - I just noticed the second rope. Is the anchor point / rope strong enough to hold the boat? I assume (and I might be wrong here) that that is used to tie off the front of the boat to help hold it on the trailer. If that's the case then you could winch in a bit, tie off the boat, winch in a bit, tie off the boat. Although if one fails then it could potentially shock load the other anchor point. But something to consider maybe. Wow - that was longer than I anticipated it. Ed 82 Hotspur Sandringham 6x6 95 Defender 110 300Tdi |
||
|
26th Nov 2019 9:35pm |
|
| sako243 Member Since: 08 Jul 2014 Location: Wales Posts: 1231
|
Of the two the firemans looks a better solution to me personally but more bulky but I guess in the fire-fighting scenario those blankets have multiple purposes so a better solution overall. The placement of the winch blanket on the 4x4 just looks wrong to me - but actually thinking about it - I'm not sure what's more likely to fail - the anchor end or the winch end. Put one at both ends would be the safest... Which brings me to question my previous post  Ed
82 Hotspur Sandringham 6x6 95 Defender 110 300Tdi |
||
|
26th Nov 2019 9:39pm |
|
| m3vert Member Since: 15 Mar 2018 Location: Central Scotland Posts: 162  
|
The firefighters are using a salvage sheet which is readily available on every front line appliance in the UK. Nice and heavy and should do the job in a failure of a Tirfor or winch. As you say same principle as a winch blanket.
|
||
|
27th Nov 2019 7:25am |
|
| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
|
Something like this?
Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge |
||
|
27th Nov 2019 7:35am |
|
| sako243 Member Since: 08 Jul 2014 Location: Wales Posts: 1231
|
Ed
82 Hotspur Sandringham 6x6 95 Defender 110 300Tdi |
||
|
27th Nov 2019 8:06am |
|
| lohr500 Member Since: 14 Sep 2014 Location: Skipton Posts: 1325 
|
Is the winch one of those two speed Maypole jobbies, with a freewheel brake lever?
We have had several failures with that design of winch at our sailing club, when people have tried to recover our larger 80HP RIBs and committee boats without having the trailers deep enough in the water. I've replaced the webbing strapping twice in the past two years due to them snapping and also replaced a whole winch assembly because the winding handle rounded off the flats where it connected to the winch body
Our trailers aren't tilting bed though, so there is a lot of force on the recovery system if people try to winch onto the trailers when the rear of the trailers aren't low enough in the water. Putting a stronger strap on the same set up will probably just move the point of failure to something else. I share sako's concern over the strain on the bow fitting. Has the trailer been built with waterproof bearings or could you convert them? It would be much kinder to the whole system if you could submerge the trailer deeper into the water and allow the Drascombe's buoyancy to assist with the retrieval. Ripping out the front bow eyelet would be a sad, costly and potentially dangerous outcome. Converting the bearings and then giving the drums a quick hosing down with fresh water after launch/retrieval would be my favoured solution. I was at Windermere in the summer and I noticed some new twin axle trailers at the marina in Bowness with a neat solution for washing down the hubs. They had what looked to be flexible irrigation hose pipe routed from a central Hozelock bayonet fitting mounted up at the front and running to each hub back plate. I bet it would be quite easy to fit something like this to an existing trailer. Nice Dascombe by the way . We had a McNulty built Lugger for 8 or 9 years when the children were growing up. |
||
|
27th Nov 2019 8:46am |
|
|
|
| All times are GMT |
< Previous Topic | Next Topic > |
Posting Rules
|
Site Copyright © 2006-2025 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis
