 | Home > General & Technical (L663) > 2020 Defender main discussion thread |
 
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| RRUK Site Supporter Member Since: 31 Mar 2010 Location: Leicestershire Posts: 2025  
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I don't think JLR want to claw back that part of the market where people have now gone to Jap pickups.
They only sold 25,000 of the original defenders per year and that included all the military and utility contracts around the world, these are tiny numbers and I'm amazed the Defender managed to cling on for so long. By comparison, JLR opens up new market niches that others copy, so the Evoque (which every traditionalist LR fan pilloried) became a best seller, the most accoladed model they've produced and sold in the hundreds of thousands if not over a million. The money created from models that are popular keeps the brand going, not just new models but also the after market for the older ones. This is a good thing. 2016 D4 HSE 1998 110 TUM HS FFR Hard Top XD WOLF 1982 Series 3 SWB Petrol |
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9th Sep 2019 8:54am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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"Tiny market place" hardly true, in the sense that plenty of manufacturers produce up to 20k units per annum per model. Indeed, within the JLR stable alone we have: XJ - 4,072 F type - 7,870 I Pace - 11,336 for fiscal year 18/19. Talk opportunity cost and combine it with the 1 million units per annum dream of the senior management and that's probably closer to why it had to go. |
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9th Sep 2019 9:27am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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The money created from models that are popular is currently disappearing into the huge black hole that is JLR finances. On revenue of £24.2 billion they have lost £3.6 billion. Rather than keep the brand going, they have actually nearly done the opposite. |
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9th Sep 2019 9:35am |
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| Farmerben Member Since: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 605 
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If this new Defender is filling a new niche its a pretty tiny one because I'm still struggling to see how this isn't totally going to eat into Disco sales. To ignore part of the market that is booming in favour of releasing another model into one you already dominate still doesn't seem to make sense to me.
The Evoque did so well and was pilloried by traditionalists for the same reason - it was truly aiming to appeal to the non-traditional LR buyers hence bringing in new custom - a gateway to the luxury Range Rover brand at a fraction of the cost in a city friendly package. The new Defender doesn't bring any new buyers to the brand that aren't already catered to. The pickup market on the other hand is HUGE. Not just "jap" trucks but take a look at pickup numbers in the US. Top 3 selling vehicles - Ford, Chevy, Dodge pickups. This is a market LR are desperate to crack with the new Defender. Top two selling vehicles in Australia? Ford Ranger and Toyota Hilux. And JLR need sales. Figures aren't exactly stellar right now. https://instagram.com/bentheoandrews |
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9th Sep 2019 9:38am |
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| Tim in Scotland Member Since: 23 May 2007 Location: The Land that time forgot Posts: 3753 
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Well with 24 hours to go to the world wide launch, it’s a bit late to be arguing over how it looks. We will all know for sure what it will look like this time tomorrow and whatever anyone here thinks about it they will have the option not to buy it. There are plenty who will buy one just to have an early one just so that they can sell it on in 6 months time and make a huge profit if waiting lists form like LR hope they will......... and haven’t seen since the launch of the Evoque in 2011.
Regardless of what you think about the shape this car has to sell in big numbers and while the Defender shape might be iconic sales were terrible and it was unprofitable to produce in its previous form, so it has to appeal to a much wider market than the old one. I think from the photos and videos we have seen it will be a huge success and might even encourage back to the brand people who have left because Disco5 was too upmarket for them, RRS is pricing itself out of the market and DiscoSport and Evoque have too many mechanical issues due to having to fit new emissions equipment to cars that JLR never had the foresight to design in properly before launch despite many years of warnings that the kit would be required. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come 2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed! |
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9th Sep 2019 9:48am |
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| milesr3 Member Since: 12 Feb 2013 Location: Suffolk Posts: 873 
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I'm liking the look of this (and the notion of a base-spec vehicle in general).  |
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9th Sep 2019 9:51am |
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| jaygti Member Since: 04 Nov 2012 Location: essex Posts: 377 
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Just pinched this off the d3 site.
Made me smile 2002 td5 90 county hardtop |
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9th Sep 2019 9:55am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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If you cast your mind back, this is a trick JLR have used before when they re-positioned the Discovery into a higher cost band to then reveal the Freelander to "inherit" the space created. Could they be doing with again? They have talked about a family of vehicles, there's a couple of new nameplates to be revealed by 2021/22. |
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9th Sep 2019 9:55am |
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| BogMonster Member Since: 05 Feb 2008 Location: Stanley Posts: 400  
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Anybody else seeing a 98 model Freelander in the latest teaser?
Click image to enlarge --- 2006 Defender 110 SW 300Tdi • 2011 Ford Ranger XLT crewcab • 2015 Defender 110 Station Wagon Utility TDCi |
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9th Sep 2019 9:55am |
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| AndrewS Member Since: 10 Apr 2007 Location: Hereford Posts: 3707 
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The reason for this was the fact that they could only build 25,000 per year, and the reason for that was they did not modernise the vehicle or production line to keep up with demand. The last factory tour I did they took me into the development of the Range Rover to show how the vehicle had changed over the years. Having finished the tour I asked the guide "So why didn't they do the same with the Defender then"? he couldn't answer. 130's have feeling's as well you know  |
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9th Sep 2019 10:16am |
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| milesr3 Member Since: 12 Feb 2013 Location: Suffolk Posts: 873
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I'm seeing a lot of Freelander in the shape of the front end, the 'barrel' sides and rear lights. I guess this is what happens when you borrow the same styling cues. |
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9th Sep 2019 10:20am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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To put that into context: Click image to enlarge Sales are actually pretty huge compared to previous years, but due to the money monster JLR created to obtain these figures, balanced the company on a knife edge where any form of head or cross wind would see them fall dramatically; and thus all the talk about stabilise, turnaround and transformation. |
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9th Sep 2019 10:34am |
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| Gone Bushy Member Since: 15 Apr 2019 Location: Peaks Posts: 8
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Oh dear JLR, it's well within my price range and I love(d) Landrover and currently have 4, all series 1's and Defenders.
I will not be a future customer  .
Sorry, the day the stopped making square rattly, leaking, uncomfortable boxes is the day you lost me forever. I don't want another soleless SUV lost in a sea of other sterile jelly moulds driven by  , I've had plenty of them and they are all dull, I want a truck. I appreciate why you've done it but The McGovern Model 6 makes me  but hope it works out for you. Come on Ratcliffe, dont let us down, your our last hope  |
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9th Sep 2019 10:56am |
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| Farmerben Member Since: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 605
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Absolutely. Huge compared with previous years. So you'd think to further increase sales and halt that decline they'd branch into part of the market they don't already dominate. https://instagram.com/bentheoandrews
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9th Sep 2019 10:57am |
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