 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Front differential pin |
 
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| rustandoil Member Since: 08 Sep 2012 Location: Cotswolds Posts: 736   
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Ouch
Whats the labour element of the bill? |
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3rd May 2017 1:13pm |
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| Balvaig Member Since: 19 Feb 2016 Location: Fife Posts: 729  
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That is extortionate, even given that they are fitting a completely new part.
You can get Ashcroft to rebuild yours, or do an exchange diff for far less. I am certain others on the forum will advise further. |
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3rd May 2017 1:23pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17338  
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A very common problem with the front diff in TDCi vehicles, and very dangerous to drive in that condition (when mine failed and the diff seized it became almost impossible to steer, others have had the fron axle lock up completely).
It should, in theory, have been avoided in post 2010 vehicles by the fitting of the two cross-pin, four gear diff in the front of all 110 and 130 wheelbase models, but it is very evident from reposts on this forum that although LR says that this happened, many, many vehicles that should have two-pin (4 gear) diffs left the factory with single-pin (2 gear) diffs. Your best solution is to get a diff from Ashcroft Transmissions of Dunstable. Your options are either a properly rebuilt standard (four gear) diff (built with much more care and precision than the original LR diff), an automatic torque-biasing (ATB) diff, which is a limited slip diff, or a full air-locking diff. Any of these will be stronger than the diff that has just failed on you. When I replaced the failed diff on my '07 110, the Ashcroft ATB was cheaper as an outright purchase for a complete assembled unit than an exchange diff from LR, by a considerable margin. Incidentally it only takes a couple of hours to swap out a front diff, so the labour component of the cost should not be especially high. The list price for a 4-gear diff from LR now is around the £1200 mark, and I think that that is for a reconditioned one on an exchange basis. |
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3rd May 2017 1:31pm |
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| IanW Member Since: 12 Jun 2011 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 172 
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Hopefully I'll have more info tomorrow. One wife - livid
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3rd May 2017 5:19pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17338
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By the way, it will look something like this:
 Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge |
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3rd May 2017 5:58pm |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8006  
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its a std 3.54 ratio LR diff, several options:
replace with 2nd hand diff replace with rebuilt OEM replace with aftermarket rebuilt diff such as std open or locker etc from Ashcrofts you need a 24spline diff. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LAND-ROVER-DEFEN...SwWxNYvCMD 2pin, £175 + fitting prob as its only 33k miles and from puma so they hike the price up or older http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LANDROVER-DEFEND...2882053067 more miles but £75 £75 is about the right going rate on a 2nd hand 3.54 ratio diff. labour - assuming no guards in place (track rod guard etc) about 2 hrs to change + some EP90. Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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3rd May 2017 6:52pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17338
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Personally I would never now fit a 2-gear diff in a TDCi 110 or 130, it isn't strong enough. 4-gear diffs fetch substantially higher prices 2nd hand and are scarcer.
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3rd May 2017 9:13pm |
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| IanW Member Since: 12 Jun 2011 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 172
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Thanks for all the helpful responses. MJF have taken out the old diff (I await pics) and the replacement should arrive there today. No wish to fork out £1100 any more than the next person, but I'm being a bit philosophical about it. We picked up a new caravan last week, and the Defender's first job on Sunday, assuming it's fixed, is to tow it to Worcestershire. The worst case scenario appears to be that the pin could come through the axle casing (so say MJF), the axle could lock, the steering become at the least unpredictable, and the vehicle shudder to a sudden stop on the M5 which might be somewhat less than helpful if there is an artic close behind. Hence the philosophy - I'll thank the technician at MJF for finding the fault, bite the bullet and cough up. Ian One wife - livid
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4th May 2017 11:18am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17338
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It would be worth checking with them when you pick it up whether the new diff is a two-gear unit (identical to that which failed) or the much stronger four-gear unit.
When mine failed my local main dealer said that LR would no longer supply two-gear diffs as replacements for 110 and 130 front axles, so hopefully you will have the stronger unit in which case you should not have this problem again. On the other hand, if the new diff is a two-gear diff identical to that which came out, it is quite possible that this will happen again in the future. |
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4th May 2017 11:27am |
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| zsd-puma Member Since: 09 Aug 2016 Location: Kent Posts: 2720 
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Have you owned the car from new? or nearly new? if you have then I would get on to LR customer services about it, the fact they've changed the spec on the newer diffs is as good as them admitting the old ones weren't up to the job.
Although you're well out of warranty, you're still covered by consumer law. Which say things should be of "reasonable quality, last a reasonable time and be fit for purpose". Which you can argue the old diffs arent. If you've only used it as a car (bearing in mind these things are designed as working extreme off road vehicles) It's possible they'll just offer you a good will gesture contribution to the cost. In normal, as opposed to hard commercial use, the diff should last the life of the car. You'd expect an expensive item like a car to last more than 9 years... Of course they might just say "no - tough luck", at which point you'd have to seek professional legal advice and go to court if you wanted to pursue it, but i'd politely try the above. Putting in the key points about reasonable time and quality, sale of goods act etc and see what they say - even if they only give you £200 it's better than nothing.  Last edited by zsd-puma on 23rd Jun 2017 10:48pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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4th May 2017 12:03pm |
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| Landie Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: WA Posts: 22  
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Mine blew up at 47000 kms. Rebuilt with ashcroft air locker At 100000 all good
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5th Jun 2017 4:13pm |
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| Mongolia Member Since: 23 Jun 2013 Location: Toulouse Posts: 45 
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Mine blew up the 1st time at 60000km (replaced on guarantee).
Now, blew up a second time at 250000km in Mexico (same break as Blackwool picture) and replaced by a 2 pins Br...rt (made by Dana). |
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23rd Jun 2017 8:45pm |
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| JWL Member Since: 26 Oct 2011 Location: Hereford Posts: 3443 
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Mine in my 110 Td5 lasted over 190K before it went, trouble was it took me near enough two days to get the little blighter out! When the planetaries and bits of pin all detached themselves they wouldn't allow the old diff to come away from the axle casing. I ended up having to take the whole axle off and roll it round into all sorts of positions to get all the bits to either completely fall out of the tubes or at least resettle in the diff assembly.
I reckon with mine that the pin had snapped a while ago but had still stayed in position, one end held by the roll pin the other bit still fixed in the planetary. Then the roll pin snapped which allowed the loose end to come out which gave me a heart rending moment the day before the lot went as it made the whole motor stop and lock up at low sped at a junction but it must have dropped straight out into the bottom of the diff pan as it seemed normal straight away. Then when the rest went, it was in the middle of evening rush hour traffic where the A49 goes through Hereford next to the football ground. At least I managed to limp half onto the pavement, jack it up to investigate, both wheels turned freely but the prop kept locking up, off with the front prop and that's how I used it untill I could source a new diff. With the planetaries dropping off the ends of the halfshafts there was a low risk of any more problems untill I could get it fixed. |
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24th Jun 2017 9:08pm |
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