DefenderOfTheEarth wrote:

TC - I've seen the "my mapped 335i is quicker than an M3" thing a few times. As you say, it's a bit silly.
However I do know a few people who take it further - they fit an LSD, mod the engine a lot (to 450+bhp), fot better brakes, shocks, etc - only then can they "worry" an M3 and even then they still don't look right.

M5 is stupidly quick - only downers are the gearbox (to some) and the hideous range between stops (and 10ish mpg)!

All "fast" BMs are good though - by fast I mean over 250bhp.

Just a wind-up guys! My 330D is stock was considering a DMS remap but now on the look-out for a 535D Touring for some DMS treatment.

DOTE - you would be my favourite fish in the pond, on the look out for hooks not bait

TC - out of interest what did you got from a tank in the M5 on a reasonable run?

Let's all be honest about this 3 or 5 series are just nice reps cars with big engines unless it came out of the M factory.

carlaac wrote:

TC - out of interest what did you got from a tank in the M5 on a reasonable run?

There is no such thing as a reasonable run

It went back never having its mpg count reset and it showed 17.2. Essentially you could get anywhere between 150 and 250 miles out of a full 70 litre tank.

5 litre V10 - If you are in anyway shape or form worried about fuel costs or are on a budget, don't even consider it. I spent the first months of ownership trying to balance economy and fun, managing c. 19mpg; I had a quiet word with myself and chucked that ethos out the window. From then on in I got little better than 12mpg....or 185 miles a tank

My record, and yes, I kept the two reciepts with dates and times, was 111 miles or 7.2 to the galloon between fills

By contrast, driving the M3 with the same ethos, I got a flat average of 23mpg......just as much fun as an M5 on the twisty stuff but the second the road straightens a little and you pop some brave pills......

TC wrote:

carlaac wrote:

TC - out of interest what did you got from a tank in the M5 on a reasonable run?

There is no such thing as a reasonable run

It went back never having its mpg count reset and it showed 17.2. Essentially you could get anywhere between 150 and 250 miles out of a full 70 litre tank.

5 litre V10 - If you are in anyway shape or form worried about fuel costs or are on a budget, don't even consider it. I spent the first months of ownership trying to balance economy and fun, managing c. 19mpg; I had a quiet word with myself and chucked that ethos out the window. From then on in I got little better than 12mpg....or 185 miles a tank

My record, and yes, I kept the two reciepts with dates and times, was 111 miles or 7.2 to the galloon between fills

By contrast, driving the M3 with the same ethos, I got a flat average of 23mpg......just as much fun as an M5 on the twisty stuff but the second the road straightens a little and you pop some brave pills......

DefenderOfTheEarth wrote:

TC - have you got anything quick now or just the Landy?

I'd struggle with just our 110 TBH - need that rush of speed every now and again. Not M3/M5 speed but fast enough.

Now there's a question!

in a word, no. My car history is rather colourful!, I just love to drive anything that is fun to drive! I used to need a speed fix but not so much anymore, my runabout is a 60 plate 116d which is a cracking little motor. Only just turned 1000 miles on the clock and it is already returning 55mpg.....5 years free servicing and £35 a year road tax.

Knowing your situation, the next statement is quite controversial! For context, I have owned (draws breath), in order:

325i
330i coupe
330d saloon
330d Touriung
535d saloon
335d touring
M5 Touring
X5 35d
M3
and now the 116d

Now, up until the M5 I always wanted quicker and quicker. The M5 went due to imminent end to warranty and as anyone who knows anything about an M5 will tell you, you need to be clinically insane to own an M5 without BMW warranty (these aftermarket warranty insurance jobs just don't cut it with M's)

Getting to the point......(honest). The X5 was bought to cart the tribe about and be a commuter bus, which it did admirably, it was just completely soulless. An amazing piece of engineering but little more......that X5 felt every bit as quick as the 335 and would easily sit at 120 all day conditions permitting. it went through boredom though in the end as did the M3

The point; Unfortunately nothing else will ever match the M5 for sheer driving dynamics, and the bottom line is that cars like that are a rich mans folly, the total cost of ownership killed it off for me in the end, if you add fuel, depreciation, insurance, security (tracker horizon minimum allowed), tyres, servicing and road tax .

Petrol = £5000 for 10,000 miles
Road Tax = £485 a year
Insurance = c. £1000 a year
Servicing = (£400 - £1500 dependant on interval / mileage)
Warranty extension = c. £1200 a year
Tyres = £1600 a year (one full set needed at least, my ratio was the standard BMW ratio of 4 backs to 2 fronts but in an M5 you would chew through that in 10,000. Rears not going much further than 6 / 7000)

= c. £10,000 a year just to run it!

+ market depreciation

(top tip - DO NOT BE TEMPTED BY ONE OF THE EARLY M5'S NOW AVAILABLE FOR APPARENTLY REASONABLE MONEY )

Because of the M5 and the M3, to me now there is no difference between a 116d and a 335d, I get as much pleasure knowing that my little one is costing me next to nothing as I did from the level of fun the 335 gave me (comparing it to an M) I am not saying that a 116 is as much fun as a 335, what I mean is that a 335 will never set my pants on fire in the same way as an M5, therefore, don't bother (if you get my drift)

My driving pleasure now comes from my Truck.....god's honest truth, my Truck beats the M5 hands down (for context, I haven't come cold feet into the truck, I have previously owned a RRS and a D3 - the Defender though woops their asses )

Glynparry25 wrote:

Haha, a 'My BMW is faster than yours' discussion has come along, lol.

I can't even get into this conversation as I couldn't afford one even if I wanted to. Plus after living in Germany I would be way more tempted by AMG or what Audi has to offer (even though Audi is getting quite a bad rep at the moment).

Just on the BMW point... if you want one as fast as a M5... just get the M5- I have to laugh every time I speak to people who talk about how fast and how responsive their car is how it is chipped so can leave a M5 in its dust and just as I am getting impressed I ask what spec it is and they point out it is a Diesel .

I had a mate with a chipped Seat Leon Diesel and he boasted about the torque day after day after day... how it was faster than a Leon sport 225. It was priceless to see the look on his face when he got beat... pluss all the modding dropped his mpg down to 25mpg which is worse than the sport!

For a trip to the Alps I would rather not take the Defender or a BMW... After driving a D4 and a FFRR I would 100% much rather one of them. you can hear a pin drop at 100mph, seats like a couch enough room to swing a cat, 30+mpg and when you are in the mountains in the snow you can still stay relaxed and enjoy the drive

Glyn

DefenderOfTheEarth wrote:

Hmmm - I know someone who has just sold his M5 for a 535d (F10 shape) and had similar dilemmas but is finding the 535d very much easier to live with. And 10ish mpg is mad - however loaded you are, that's just not practical. If the M5 came with a 100 litre tank then maybe but it doesn't so range is in the Evo league.

I've had access to a 355, tested loads of loon cars and find the 335d a good balance of strong performance and practicality. Something like an RS4 Avant (which I looked at too) is just too much hard work to look after and keep fuelled up. An M5 Touring was simply too much to run and I NEED range between stops as I HATE filling up!

TBH though, if the M5 was the "peak" and helped you lose interest in fast cars, maybe it actually saved you money in the long run!

Driven a 120d and a 116i - nice handling little cars but they lack that slug of proper poke found in any decent 6/8 pot BM. Interiors a bit lower rent too.

Glyn - no other BM gets close to the M5. Apart from the M6. A diesel can be mapped to death - max bhp is 350. The M5 (and M6) have over 500. Nowhere near. Only the 550i gets "slightly" close.

Speaking of range between stops, I filled mine yesterday, drove off the forecourt, toggled the computer and the range stated was 817 miles......

The defender is pushing M3 figures though

DefenderOfTheEarth wrote:

I'm in denial with our Defender. I just fill it up, drive it around then rather sooner than expected, fill it up again...

I've had 500 mile range in the BM before - not often but it's usually over 400 miles between stops. Veeery handy.

The trap I am falling into is that I did the maths on the defender based on primarily holiday / runabout mileage. BIG mistake, I can't keep out of it, I drive it everywhere! Only had it since the end of November and already clocked up 1200 miles in it and I haven't driven the bloody thing for work either.....it puts a smile on my face like no other car I have owned.

If you are ever up glos way and spot a grinning lunatic in a 110 DC hill billy looking thing, just wave