 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Is a Puma significantly better than a TD5? |
 
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| chopdogs Member Since: 10 Mar 2010 Location: Wiltshire Posts: 108   
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I have a 52 plate TD5 90 but need a forward facing seat in the back
Have posted a query on how easy it is to change the side facing seats for Puma forward facing seats but I have another option.........chop in the TD5 for a Puma (I want to stick with a 90). I wondered how many of you have had both and whether you could give your thoughts on whether there is a significant difference between the cars and what those differences are. Basically, is it worth money - probably around £6-8k - to upgrade to a Puma? Thanks chopdogs |
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19th Jul 2010 10:46am |
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| wyvern Member Since: 13 Dec 2009 Location: Cornwall Posts: 2108 
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I've had a S2a, S3, TDI, TD5 and now the TDCI(puma) and think that the puma is the best of the bunch so far.
my TD5 was an early one and had lots of problems to start with, but it was sorted out with no real issues. I remember the skiterbug at the time was that the TD5 was a naf engine with too much electronics and the TDI was better 'cus it was a mor ebasic engine - so this is all a bit similar. For me there are many good points for the new motor, it's much quicker, quieter, has 6 gears and has the heater that all others will be judged by! But it's still a real landrover and does the business when needed. Plus it's basicly a tranist engine and there are lots of mechs about who know their way around it. I'm a happy bunny! Poppy - TDCI (Puma) 110XS 2.2 - Camper conversion - see the build here - https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic56530.html Elgar -TDCI(Puma) 110XS Dormobile - now sold Devon & Cornwall 4x4 Response - DC126  |
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19th Jul 2010 11:57am |
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| Naks Member Since: 27 Jan 2009 Location: Stellenbosch, ZA Posts: 2638  
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If your Td5 is sorted and does everything you need it to, then stick with it. IMHO, not worth getting a Puma, ur just setting yourself up for headaches with LR. |
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19th Jul 2010 12:41pm |
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| Mad Cow Member Since: 27 Oct 2009 Location: Hertfordshire Posts: 292  
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If you are happy with the TD5 why not buy some forward facing seats from Exmoor Trim? About £150 each I think.
http://www.exmoortrim.co.uk/images/stories/catalogue/cat.pdf Although if you need a forward facing seat for a baby/child seat, I think you will need the "lock and fold seat" which is no doubt more expensive (still cheaper than upgrading the vehicle though) 
I've got a Puma and I think it's great. Never driven a TD5 Defender but I used to have a TD5 Disco II so hard to make a direct comparison. Disco always felt a bit underpowered but then it is considerably heavier than a Defender. MAD COW 2007 90 Hard Top - 2009 BMW F800GS - 2002 CCM 604E Dual Sport Project90 |
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19th Jul 2010 1:02pm |
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| stevie d Member Since: 09 Nov 2009 Location: Bishops Stortford Posts: 342
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Chopdogs,
I've got 2 forward facing seats that I am happy to sell. They are in my TD5 the seats are as new, covered in the std LR herringbone type cloth. I want to get bench seats as never use the seats as they are. If interested let me know. Steve Defender 90 TD5 Station Wagon Discovery 3 HSE BMW 330i Coupe |
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19th Jul 2010 3:12pm |
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| Scallops Member Since: 15 Aug 2007 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 89 
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Without a shadow of a doubt - stick with your TD5.
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19th Jul 2010 10:55pm |
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| spudfan Member Since: 10 Sep 2007 Location: Co Donegal Posts: 4662 
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Have had the Puma for two years now and have used the warranty. Great machine. Visit a few dealers talk to them and get a feel for whoever will give you the best back up service. This is not the salesman but the service manager. This holds for any car you are thinking of buying. Having owned and lived with a Td5 you know what Defenders are like. This will allow you to give any Puma a thorough pre delivery inspection, independent of the dealer. Search my posts on this site and the Australian site for my views and experiences with the Puma.All of the Land Rover sites have people looking for help with ALL types of Land Rovers.People are worried about the clutch on the Puma. The clutch on my 200 Tdi went. Big deal I got it changed. The pros certainly outweigh the cons with the Puma as far as we are concerned. It drives that beautifully you wish journeys were longer! My big negative is that the fuel consumption is more than the Tdi but everything else is so, so much nicer. Anyway your decision. Go and pester some service managers, voice your concerns and listen to their response. 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali 2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu 2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai |
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20th Jul 2010 9:28am |
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| jst Member Since: 14 Jan 2008 Location: Taunton Posts: 8030  
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i had a td5 90 for 8 yrs from new and now have a Puma 110. i cant make a 90 vs 110 comparison but i can say the both have their merits.
The puma is much much better, quieter, easier to drive (torque etc) far better dash/heaters and better gear range 1st being 22%(?) lower than the td5 and 6th being sig higher than 5th in the td5. plus it doesnt leak. i had an early td5 (99plate) and had no warranty issues with it, just changed the clutch and flywheel at 105k miles. Puma has done 20k miles in 2 yrs and has had a new rear diff. Would i change again, yes without a shadow of a doubt. Cheers James 110 2012 XS Utility 130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper 90 2010 Hardtop 90 M57 1988 Hardtop |
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20th Jul 2010 8:55pm |
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| mse Member Since: 06 Apr 2008 Location: UK Posts: 5035 
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No question the puma
Ive had a 3.5v8, 2.5td 300tdi Defender, TD5 Dicso - new (replaced for a) 300 TDi disco that was one year old By far (with maybe the exception of the v  the Puma is the best, in all scoring categories. Mike |
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21st Jul 2010 10:03am |
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| spudfan Member Since: 10 Sep 2007 Location: Co Donegal Posts: 4662
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I am comparing my Puma to previous Land Rovers I have driven, i.e. 2.5 TD (6 years), 2.5 tdi(14 years) and a 2.25 series 111 used on and off over last 5 years. While all the above are fine machines and I enjoyed them all the Puma is definately in a class of it's own. My daughter keeps asking as to when we will be putting the series 111 back in action-reverse gear disappeared. Can't see myself spending too much time in the series 111 after living with the Puma. It is a big enough shock going back to the tdi! 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali 2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu 2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai |
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22nd Jul 2010 10:47am |
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| Gav110 Member Since: 14 Feb 2010 Location: Sydney Posts: 16
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The Puma is in a different league to the TD5 and all previous models.
Everything before was rough and agricultural outside and in. We all love agricultural outside - it's the perfect shape and build - otherwise why buy a Defender, but what has surprised me is just what a joy the Puma is to drive. The ventilation makes a massive difference. That's apparent here in AUS, but I can imagine the heating and demisting must be unbelievable in the UK. I have never experienced getting into a TD5 on a soaking wet and humid day when I was soaking wet and steaming - and not having steamy windows. It's just unsafe. In a Puma, same incident - clear windows all round in seconds. I also ticked the box on the factory sunroof option - best $150 money can buy, plus the factory expedition roof rack. I have mostly other custom mods - being done by www.mulgo.com.au - fabulous engineering guy here in Sydney. The noise inside and out is down by about 50% over my old TD5 - there's none of that off-beat TD5 clatter. Smoothness of engine is fantastic. The gearing - others have spoken about it is awesome - but the anti-stall is incredibly handy offroad and on - like when setting off with a heavy trailer on a steep hill - just ease out the clutch in 1st HI and let it walk away - only a test drive can help you understand this. The highway gearing makes for brilliant touring, esp. when paired with a good after market cruise control. I have an office in Melbourne (1000km away) and now drive down every month rather than fly. With cruise control, long range tank, a bit more sound insulation and a good after market stereo - it's the best tourer on the market. The extra low down torque is much more useful than the TD5's extra top-end. I had my TD5 "fully worked" with 3" exhaust, larger intercooler and chip so it put out something like 550nm - and it was largely all wasted as who wants to rev a diesel at 3000 RPM+ ? It was fun for outrunning Jeep Wranglers though.... 
The new seats in both row 2 and 3 are again like driving in a completely different vehicle. They are shaped, supportive and have proper head restraints. The kids are much more comfortable. Despite what some have said, I managed to fit comfortably into the 3rd row seats (5'9" - and I've even seen a 6 footer) - though obviously the leg room is better geared towards kids - but it will take a big kid and still leave room for stowage. The concerns for me are same as others - drivetrain. I have a new clutch and syncros being fitted, but as others have said, once they sort this out it will be fine. Nothing else feels 'weak' to me - just a lot more sophisticated and well engineered. I took the precaution of buying the extended warranty (6 years total) which gives me all the peace of mind I need. I figure that once the 6 years is up, if I have a major issue I will tot-up the cost of replacing axles/clutch/box etc vs buying new - given the extensive mods I am making. I actually think outlaying $6-10K if that's what it might cost then - is not a bad option over buying a new vehicle at that time, especially if it gets me a bullet-proof drivetrain (e.g. MaxiDrive / Isuzu / Mog etc.). In summary - couldn't be happier and am feeling confident in the choice. Best of luck mate. Gavster 2010 Puma 110 |
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22nd Jul 2010 11:36pm |
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| KarlB Member Since: 08 Feb 2010 Location: Canberra Posts: 91 
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Well said Gav. My Puma 90 is a dream and better than my Disco II. And the old County D110 is just not in the race.
Cheers KarlB |
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23rd Jul 2010 1:00am |
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| harveyg77 Member Since: 09 Apr 2010 Location: Derby Posts: 309
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If you look at the facts such as the Puma's wider ratio of gears, better heating/ventilation, etc. etc. then the Puma is better than a Td5. Some people will argue about reliability and mention how they've had problems. But I woudl suggest they are subjective matters. The Td5 had its problems when new, as did nearly every Land-Rover ever made.
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23rd Jul 2010 6:58am |
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| alantd Member Since: 14 Dec 2008 Location: Northamptonshire Posts: 1513 
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The PUMA is definitely easier to live with than the Td5. It performs better in almost all situations. A definite improvement.
Personally, I don't think we'll look back on the PUMA engine favourably - I doubt it's a keeper (Td5 was, IMHO, a better engine but doesn't meet the modern emissions regs) but hey, in 5 years time I'll just swap it out for a different lump - that's the beauty of the Defender, right? Being a big softee (or, more importantly, having a family that I need to cart around in the Defender) I couldn't do without the long 6th gear and the aircon. I loved my Td5 but I've not looked back. Occasionally I miss the air vents but even then not really. One that started out as a 2.4 TDCi 110 XS + New Defender 110 First Edition |
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23rd Jul 2010 11:20am |
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