 | Home > Off Topic > Grangemouth |
 
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| shaggydog Member Since: 12 Aug 2012 Location: Kent Posts: 3347   
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Reminds me of miners strikes, spent so long striking that the mine filled up with water and then when they stopped striking the mine was flooded so they had no job to go back to....
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24th Oct 2013 9:31pm |
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| mk1collector Member Since: 17 Sep 2009 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 6769  
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It seems they didn't see the bigger picture and were firmly put in there place
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24th Oct 2013 10:01pm |
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| MartinK Member Since: 02 Mar 2011 Location: Silverdale (Lancashire/Cumbria Border) Posts: 2665 
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The effects of closure will be a huge issue for the local area, towns like Bo'ness, Falkirk & Grangemouth are already fairly depressed with not many jobs around.
I can't imagine closure will help Salmond's Independance mullarkey very much either (after RBS meltdown Edinburgh Trams fiasco, and Scottish Parliament spiralling costs etc etc). More Scots on the dole, and less income for the locality won't help a cause for independance (not that it's a good idea anyway). Reminds me of Dundee's Timex factory closure a few years ago...similar circumstances where staff & management weren't pulling together for the overall good (I guess Ford's Dagenham Dream could also have similarities). Defender "Puma" 2.4 110 County Utility (possibly the last of the 2.4's) |
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25th Oct 2013 6:35am |
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| bpman Member Since: 21 May 2008 Location: Oslo Posts: 8069 
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You can see both sides of the argument, who would want to sign up for worse T&C's but the flip side is at least you still have a job ... this is where "unions" need to think about both sides very carefully ... fingers crossed for a good outcome
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25th Oct 2013 6:42am |
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| GUM97 Member Since: 05 Feb 2012 Location: Cheshire Posts: 3555 
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Well it's just been announced that its staying open, thank god for that! This has been a classic example of a company being fed up of all the bureaucracy of the unions, so they called their bluff. And what happened? The company got their way! The union bosses wouldn't have been too bothered if the plant had shut, I'm sure they'd still have kept their jobs! An engine to TDi for!
"Land Rover- Proudly turning drivers into mechanics since 1948"  |
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25th Oct 2013 10:19am |
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| MartinK Member Since: 02 Mar 2011 Location: Silverdale (Lancashire/Cumbria Border) Posts: 2665
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That'll have helped 
Good news anyway, lots of people retain jobs in an area that needs jobs. Defender "Puma" 2.4 110 County Utility (possibly the last of the 2.4's) |
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25th Oct 2013 10:53am |
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| party monkey Member Since: 31 Dec 2010 Location: Oxon. Posts: 1311 
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Well said MartinK... Something the Unite bosses perhaps overlooked considering Grangemouth is Scotland's one an only refinery. I know a few guys on the supply/fuels quality side up there and it's been a torrid time for them, so at least, for now, things look more positive. Utter utter f*ckwits Unite..... Ineos acquired the refinery and the staff from BP and that came with a particularly good set of t&c's for the workers. Something Ineos I think tried to change in the past and failed. This time around though, it seems like it was a case of 'do or die ' and whilst it can't be great for the staff to take a hit, if it comes down to a choice of having a job or not then I think most reasonably minded people would reluctantly accept it and then consider their future. I'm not so sure it was a bluff though as without that support from both Scottish and UK government, that plant would probably have been at risk of closure at some stage in the future. Whatever it was, it's a clever way of generating government backed funding. And on a selfish note, at least we'll get our bills paid too ! Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless. |
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25th Oct 2013 11:21am |
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| AndyS Member Since: 18 Aug 2012 Location: London Posts: 595 
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I worked for Unite for 25 years and they changed our terms and conditions on a regular basis, sometimes good and sometimes bad. We had our pension restructured and pay evaluated (elaborate way of saying 'cut'). I don't know what is going on at Grangemouth but I can't believe the Union would have called them out on strike just because the company needed to restructure the terms and conditions in order to survive. There has to be more to it than that.
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25th Oct 2013 3:28pm |
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| Jonno1968 Member Since: 24 Oct 2013 Location: Leicestershire Posts: 245 
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I closed a business in southern ireland as the unions made it impossible to run. If we changed the time of tea breaks we had to go into lengthy consultation. It was not condusive to progress so we closed it. End of.
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25th Oct 2013 4:16pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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What mine was that - all the mines I knew had maintenance teams that worked with union agreement to meet all the statutory and maintenance requirements to ensure they could stay open long term? To others who think "the unions were put in their place" - what would you do to protect your pension and terms and conditions? I think i would have wanted the unions to take the employers to the brink also. |
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25th Oct 2013 4:43pm |
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| Odin Member Since: 29 Apr 2011 Location: Aberdeenshire Posts: 237  
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Whilst the majority of folks are concerned with keeping a workforce in employment and an Operator in business within central Scotland I think it's vital that unhelpful and ill informed comments such as yours are highlighted as such. You cannot grossly simplify such issues by referring to the cars in the car park nor the cashflow as losing the capability to refine products within Scotland, whilst several Operators are investing Billions in deep sea environments and require processing capability close to hand, is unhelpful. Especially as the competing refineries around the hemisphere are also struggling with margins.
Rather than lose the capability within the UK I'd rather we accepted the short term operating loss and worked on developing medium term safe operating plans. Having a perspective on the market would be helpful but in the meantime you keep adding value with your insightful and incisive comments as someone who's worked on over a thousand rigs worldwide. |
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26th Oct 2013 10:14pm |
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| Odin Member Since: 29 Apr 2011 Location: Aberdeenshire Posts: 237
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Looks as though someone has cut Red Dot's comments.
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26th Oct 2013 10:16pm |
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| RED-DOT Member Since: 29 Jun 2009 Location: stirling Posts: 2363
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And most of yours at my request or did you not notice that either? 2008 RS4 gone, 123d M Sport, and a Puma 90 XS..
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26th Oct 2013 10:30pm |
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| Odin Member Since: 29 Apr 2011 Location: Aberdeenshire Posts: 237
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26th Oct 2013 10:33pm |
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