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party monkey



Member Since: 31 Dec 2010
Location: Oxon.
Posts: 1311
England 2005 Defender 110 Td5 XS CSW Cairns Blue
Noise+TC light when cold and left lock applied
Folks... an odd one for you....

Over the last couple of days from cold, I have been getting a slight groaning coming from offside front when a small to medium amount of left lock is applied.... for example......

Turning left from 12 o’clock to 10 o’clock I get a little noise. Turning left from 12 o’clock to 8 o’clock I get a hell of a noise and the TC light comes on the dash until I straighten up.

The noise is best described as a groan, not a metallic sound. It's very similar sound to the groan I get from the flywheel spigot bush on these colder mornings.

The noise + TC light is only present for the first few miles on left turns and then it goes away. Speed doesn't seem to be a factor in the severity of the noise.

Haven't had a chance yet to explore more in daylight. PAS fluid level is fine though. Haven't tinkered with the steering lock stops, so shouldn't be any rubbing. Recently checked all wheels for play and it sailed through the MOT last week, so I'm discounting wheel bearing at the mo.

Welcome any suggestions/pointers Very Happy Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless.
Post #107732 15th Dec 2011 11:28pm
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Paul_1978



Member Since: 08 Nov 2009
Location: South Yorkshire
Posts: 384
England 2004 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Zermatt Silver
Wheel bearing on the way out?
Post #107746 16th Dec 2011 7:33am
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K9F



Member Since: 12 Nov 2009
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 9610
United Kingdom 2008 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
Check the TC/ABS wiring loom for chafing and/or damage. It sounds to be as though you possibly have a short circuit. I had similar on the rear a couple of years ago and it was just that, predominantly in damp conditions but disappeared when the loom dried out! Good luck with reaching a quick resolution.

Thumbs Up If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!

Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!!
Post #107770 16th Dec 2011 10:09am
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ben_j85jty



Member Since: 02 Sep 2008
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire
Posts: 491
United Kingdom 2002 Defender 110 Td5 XS DCPU Bonatti Grey
I would concur with both of the above...

When breaking do you find you press the pedal further the first time than the second? 2002 Defender 110 DC
Post #107801 16th Dec 2011 1:03pm
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party monkey



Member Since: 31 Dec 2010
Location: Oxon.
Posts: 1311
England 2005 Defender 110 Td5 XS CSW Cairns Blue
No excessive brake pedal travel on first press that I've noticed. I've provisionally scheduled a quick check over at my local indy for early next week and will get them to check the bearing too, just to be on the safe side.

Near side front wheel bearing was replaced earlier this year following some spectacular metallic grinding noises one morning.

I'll be able to have a decent mooch around over the weekend but the noise I'm getting is more consistent with chaffing/rubbing and along with the TC light initially when cold, makes me thinks K9F has a good point.

Thanks all again..... Bow down Will report back Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless.
Post #107879 16th Dec 2011 5:45pm
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BigMike



Member Since: 13 Jul 2010
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 2253
United Kingdom 
wheel bearing or diff. check the bearing yourself by jacking it up and seeing if you can waggle it top/bottom.

my vote is diff.
Post #107883 16th Dec 2011 6:04pm
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Lorryman100



Member Since: 01 Oct 2010
Location: Here
Posts: 2686
From what you describe I would think the wheel bearing is causing the issue by inducing a larger air gap in the wheel speed sensor causing the TC/ABS to operate. As K9F states, you can also check the abs harness for signs of damage, or plug in a diagnostic tool capable of showing live data of the voltages at the wheel speed sensor to show any discrepancies from the normal 2.1-2.3 volts through the movement of the wheel, until you get the TC/ABS light. The wheel bearing is easy to check as Mike has already stated, if there is no play with the bearing then the harness/sensor is the most likely culprit.


Brian.
Post #107946 16th Dec 2011 8:58pm
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ben_j85jty



Member Since: 02 Sep 2008
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire
Posts: 491
United Kingdom 2002 Defender 110 Td5 XS DCPU Bonatti Grey
Nanocom will be able to check if its the sensor. I have one if you want to give it a go 2002 Defender 110 DC
Post #107982 16th Dec 2011 11:53pm
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party monkey



Member Since: 31 Dec 2010
Location: Oxon.
Posts: 1311
England 2005 Defender 110 Td5 XS CSW Cairns Blue
Thanks all again for the suggestions.... I will check for wheel bearing play tomorrow. I checked that about 2 weeks ago ahead of the MOT last week but I do appreciate that the bearings can go from being fine one minute to knackered the next with precious little warning.

Ben - might take you up on the Nanocom offer (have another possible issue too).... we could sort out that Cadets stuff at the same time Mr. Green How you fixed Sunday ? Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless.
Post #107988 17th Dec 2011 12:52am
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party monkey



Member Since: 31 Dec 2010
Location: Oxon.
Posts: 1311
England 2005 Defender 110 Td5 XS CSW Cairns Blue
Quick update.

No play noted on wheel. No untoward noises on rotation either. Will have some more time tomorrow to have a proper mooch about. Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless.
Post #108027 17th Dec 2011 10:28am
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party monkey



Member Since: 31 Dec 2010
Location: Oxon.
Posts: 1311
England 2005 Defender 110 Td5 XS CSW Cairns Blue
Popped over to see Ben_j85jty today to take up his very kind offer of a quick 'nanocom'ing

Upshot is that the the 'Left' (Nanocom's terms) ABS/TC sensor is playing up.

I had managed to squeeze her in at my local indy for an hour or two max of investigations ahead of crimbo, Armed with today's info, I can give them a darn good steer (no pun intended) as to where the problem lies.

With thanks to Ben for his help today Bow down and also to all those who posted on this thread Thumbs Up Jon - 110 td5 [sold]. Currently Defenderless.
Post #108250 18th Dec 2011 7:53pm
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ben_j85jty



Member Since: 02 Sep 2008
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire
Posts: 491
United Kingdom 2002 Defender 110 Td5 XS DCPU Bonatti Grey
You're more than welcome! 2002 Defender 110 DC
Post #108273 18th Dec 2011 8:53pm
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jst



Member Since: 14 Jan 2008
Location: Taunton
Posts: 8051
 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Stornoway Grey
just order up and change the sensor yourself if its shown as a faulty on nanocom

that accounts for the light on the dash

what about the groan.

when the last bearing failed, if it broke up maybe some swarf has contaminated the kingpin bearings?

BigMike - on the front movement top to bottom could indicate wheel bearing and/or kingpin bearing wear
movement left to right will only show wheel bearing wear. Cheers

James
110 2012 XS Utility
130 2011 M57 bespoke Camper
90 2010 Hardtop
90 M57 1988 Hardtop
Post #108446 19th Dec 2011 3:04pm
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Lorryman100



Member Since: 01 Oct 2010
Location: Here
Posts: 2686
Jon, you say that the left wheel sensor is playing up, in what way? Is it a higher voltage or no voltage at all? It could just be the air gap needs adjusted very slightly as the expansion of parts when warm could bring it back in line. Let me know the readings you got by pm if you would be so kind.


Brian.
Post #108465 19th Dec 2011 4:22pm
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ben_j85jty



Member Since: 02 Sep 2008
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire
Posts: 491
United Kingdom 2002 Defender 110 Td5 XS DCPU Bonatti Grey
It was comming up with 2 errors,

First was out of ranged, logged 255 ( the maximum that can be recorded ) and intermittent comms 255 times. There were the same errors I had when I broke the sensor doing a swivel rebuild.

My guess is knackered sensor/loom. Part Monkey is sending it to the local LR independent for ease and speed a it's his daily drive..... I am sure he will be along soon to say much the same! 2002 Defender 110 DC
Post #108474 19th Dec 2011 5:23pm
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