 | Home > Technical > Steering - Terminology (Track rods, drag links etc) |
 
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5818   
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Morning all,
Firstly, Happy New Year, may 2024 be healthy and bountiful. Following on from my steering woes, I'm looking to get the steering bars, tie-rod ends etc upgraded. I'm going to get myself fully 'Gwyn Lewised'. However, I'm slightly confused by all the terminology and kits available on his site. The question is, is a Steering Bar the same as a Drag Link Bar? GL does a full 'Defender Drop Arm Conversion Kit with Track Rod' which is what I'm looking to buy. However he also does a Steering Bar 'Kit', but also elsewhere offers simply a Drag Link Bar. I'm looking to get a full steering set, and also do the steering arm conversion, so the kit is what I'm after. But I want to do the full steering set up (everything) in one hit, so do I need a drag link bar as well, or is that simply the steering bar found in the Steering Bar Conversion Kit with Track Rod? I've looked at diagrams, and I can only see two rods, but there doesn't seem to be any consistency between terminology, variously referring to steering bars and drag rods. For example on one diagram it refers to the Drag Link Bar, but then on the same diagram refers to the damper clamp that attaches to it, as the 'Steering Bar' clamp. So I am assuming they are one and the same thing? I'm asking/clarifying as I'm shipping from the UK and don't want to mess about having to re-order missing parts. Any help welcome.  Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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3rd Jan 2024 6:59am |
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| 300TDi CSW Phil Member Since: 03 Apr 2016 Location: Bracknell Posts: 750  
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Grenadier,
I think this is the kit you need: https://gwynlewis4x4.co.uk/product/defende...-hd-steel/ Of course this assumes you have a RHD with a 4 bolt steering box (it does say LHD is available if you contact them). This looks like it replaces the drop arm and all steering links. The Drag link goes from the steering box to hub and the Track rod joins the two hubs. What I cant work out from this page is whether the clamp for the steering damper is included but it doesn't look like a steering damper is. From memory when I bought some Gwyn Lewis bits he is a really helpful guy if you call him. 1995 300 Tdi Epsom Green - It's a keeper. Wide Track Sankey- In bits- Gone to a new home M0XQS Last edited by 300TDi CSW Phil on 3rd Jan 2024 8:47am. Edited 1 time in total |
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3rd Jan 2024 8:13am |
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5818
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Thank you both.
Suspected as much, the 'Steering' bar term being an unofficial replacement to drag link. Phil, that's the kit I'm looking for, and agreed, think I will also have to buy the clamp. But wondering why you chose the HD steel version as opposed to the SS version? Cost? Strength? Other? Also do either of you (or anyone else) have a view on the Delphi versus Lemforder track rod ends? FYI, I drive 85% on road and my 'off-road' is gravel or hard pack trails. NO greenlaning or serious off-roading. So: HD or SS? Delphi or Lemforder? Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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3rd Jan 2024 8:59am |
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| rustandoil Member Since: 08 Sep 2012 Location: Cotswolds Posts: 738  
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Thats the kit I bought, I went for the Stainless Steel version, but I cant remember what track rod ends I went for
Pretty sure the damper mount is included in the kit |
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3rd Jan 2024 9:43am |
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| Inguz Member Since: 06 Sep 2020 Location: In the wild Posts: 101 |
I got the Gwyn Lewis kit. It's a great piece of kit. The clamp was included. I went for the HD TRE's as I spend a lot of time offroad and the vehicle is full of overlanding gear.
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3rd Jan 2024 10:37am |
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| Retroanaconda Member Since: 04 Jan 2012 Location: Scotland Posts: 2647 
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I bought the Gwyn Lewis rods for mine, apart from anything else they’re cheaper than the weaker original parts and obviously much less likely to get damaged.
Standard GL bars and the Lemforder TREs would be my recommendation. The only reason to go stainless is for bling purposes. Replacing the drop arm is not required, personally I prefer the original setup to the Disco drop arm conversion. |
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3rd Jan 2024 11:05am |
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| Race.it Member Since: 27 Aug 2019 Location: Algeciras Posts: 817  
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He does the LHD kit with no issues, have one on mine, one thing I would buy also is the laser kit to remove the arm from the steering box. I also went with the re-greaseable thingys Searching for my first Defender...and started just as Covid hit, so talk about timing.
5 months after starting the search I found it, and here is the details |
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3rd Jan 2024 11:59am |
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| LR90XS2011 Member Since: 05 Apr 2011 Location: bickenhill Posts: 3641 
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can I suggest you phone him he is mega helpful, I also have the full kit and disco arm, steering is much more direct,
note there are lots of track rod end options some best for off road some best for road. DEFENDER 90 TDCI XS, I hope everyone is well and your land rovers make you happy |
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3rd Jan 2024 12:09pm |
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| sako243 Member Since: 08 Jul 2014 Location: Wales Posts: 1218  
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Stainless is generally more brittle than mild steel so you're more to bend the mild and snap the stainless. Having said that Gwyn's stuff is all over engineered so largely irrelevant.
It's difficult to pinpoint it exactly but changing mine from Def to Disco vastly improved the feel of the steering but a load of other steering related components were serviced at the same time. What is obvious though is that I haven't had to replace the TRE on the drag link / box joint anywhere near as often. In fact I think the last MOT was the first time since installing the kit 8 years ago. I used to be replacing the Swan neck balljoint on average every 18 months. I have also had the circlip and plate / spring pop out of the standard Defender setup luckily off-road. A slightly worn arm coupled with lots of bouncing I think. Luckily steering was still connected just very very sloppy. Assuming the nut doesn't undo that's not possible on the Disco style. Ed 82 Hotspur Sandringham 6x6 95 Defender 110 300Tdi |
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3rd Jan 2024 12:15pm |
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| 300TDi CSW Phil Member Since: 03 Apr 2016 Location: Bracknell Posts: 750
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@grenadier steel or stainless steel is probably just a personal choice, as said before either will be a million (probably) times stronger than the original parts having put Gwynn's mud flap mounts on mine.
Sumo bars are on my list of to do's (you know the ever growing never shrinking one) and when I initially put them on the list there wasn't a stainless option (no doubt someone will point out how long it has been on my to do list for  ) 1995 300 Tdi Epsom Green - It's a keeper.
Wide Track Sankey- In bits- Gone to a new home M0XQS |
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3rd Jan 2024 1:31pm |
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| Dinnu Member Since: 24 Dec 2019 Location: Lija Posts: 3414  
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I only replaced once in 30 years of Land Rover owning. And steering is used quite extensively on small windy roads. But any idea why the Defender and Discovery had different drop arm setups? I believe that, the Discovery design is cheaper to make, so why did Land Rover keep the Defender drop arm design up to 2016? 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing 2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black |
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3rd Jan 2024 1:54pm |
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