 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Timing Chain snapped |
 
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| landy andy Member Since: 15 Feb 2009 Location: Ware, Herts Posts: 5700  
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Have you turned engine over by hand ?
Do you have the skill/ability/tools to put a replacement chain on it your self? I would remove the cam, and then compression test all the cylinders but understand that may require you buying some tools. |
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17th Jun 2022 9:06am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17382  
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I think that there are three immediately obvious easy courses of action. (1) get someone who knows these engines to look at it, (2) remove the cylinder head and inspect for damage, or (3) fit a new timing chain etc and see what happens when you try to start it.
I appreciate (3) runs the risk of money down the drain if the engine has already been destroyed but if you have got away with it it is the quickest and cheapest solution. (2) involves more work, more parts, and more cost if you have been lucky but next to no extra cost if you haven't. (1) involves paying someone else to do either (2) or (3) for you. Did the engine just die, or were there horrible noises? Many years ago the cambelt failed on my Mk5 Cortina, and I was very lucky - there was a very slight witness mark in the carbon on one piston where it had grazed a valve, but all the valves were straight and the mark didn't extend through the carbon to the piston. "Lucky" does happen sometimes! Fingers crossed for you! |
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17th Jun 2022 10:21am |
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| Wethering Landy Member Since: 17 Jun 2022 Location: Suffolk Posts: 39 
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Thanks for the replies.
The engine sounded like it jumped out of gear - so a single 'clunk' and then the revs just faded away and it died. I don't know anyone locally who knows the Puma engine. There are plenty of folk who know Landrovers - but they all know the Tdi - and seem to think Puma is a swear word! Perhaps there is a contact at Ford one could call? I haven't tried to turn it over by hand. Would I need to fit a new chain for this? I am assuming so. I think I can fit a chain as I have all the cover plate and old chain off. I think it comes as a kit and I will need a new cam cover plate I believe. Is fitting a chain difficult if I follow Keswick Nigel's Youtube video and timing marks etc? Will I need tools please? If I wanted to pressure test the cylinders, what will I need please? If I wanted to remove the cylinder head, I guess this is just a bit more time I need to invest. I have most of the top of the engine already off - so can see the valves, inlet, outlet etc. I have a basic workshop set of tools and some friends with some knowledge who can help and are keen. My ideal would be to fix it myself but I am not a skilled mechanic and so am worried I am wading out of my depth here. I am sorry for all the questions but I want to achieve a result without spending £££ at a garage to be told it's dead. |
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17th Jun 2022 10:59am |
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| BrickBox Member Since: 05 Oct 2021 Location: Wales Posts: 822 
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If the engine is potentially dead anyway - you shouldn’t really do anymore harm by investigating anyway.
If you can get a cheap Bluetooth bore scope off eBay - that’ll give you some kind of indication of what mess is inside the engine. 2008 2.4 110 Utility Station Wagon XS. |
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17th Jun 2022 11:21am |
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| Co1 Member Since: 19 Aug 2018 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 3675 
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Kudos for giving it a go yourself. As BrickBox says, if it’s goosed your can’t really do any more harm by investigating it yourself so you might as well have first crack.
Nigel’s vids are very good. He used to frequent the forum quite a bit (GloucesterNige) but haven’t seen him for a while. |
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17th Jun 2022 11:31am |
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| LR90XS2011 Member Since: 05 Apr 2011 Location: bickenhill Posts: 3641 
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try a transit garage they will have had this happen on customers vans
alternatively be patient and someone in the know will come along and answer the toast or not question DEFENDER 90 TDCI XS, I hope everyone is well and your land rovers make you happy |
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17th Jun 2022 1:33pm |
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| Wethering Landy Member Since: 17 Jun 2022 Location: Suffolk Posts: 39
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I think the borescope sounds a plan - but I am no expert and won't know what to look for. I am patient and I am sure we will find the answer.
Does anyone know how hard it is to take the head off? I have most stuff already stripped back: Timing change cover Timing change + pulleys etc Alternator (it got in the way) Injectors + wiring loom Various pipes Air intake Rocker cover Is it just another step or a total ball ache? |
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17th Jun 2022 1:54pm |
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| BrickBox Member Since: 05 Oct 2021 Location: Wales Posts: 822
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If the rocker is off, you should be able to see the head bolts.
You should be able to put the bore scope down the injector holes, if I’m not mistaken.. 2008 2.4 110 Utility Station Wagon XS. |
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17th Jun 2022 2:36pm |
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| Wethering Landy Member Since: 17 Jun 2022 Location: Suffolk Posts: 39
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Yes I got it off - but it was getting dark and I wasn't looking for bolts. See image. I will have a look over the weekend maybe.
So I just unbolt it? I assume when I put it back together it will need to be done up in sequence and to a certain torque? |
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17th Jun 2022 2:43pm |
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| BrickBox Member Since: 05 Oct 2021 Location: Wales Posts: 822
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Yes - I’m sure the torque settings and direction will be on here somewhere. Usually you start from the centre 2 and work your way out in a circular motion when refitting. 2008 2.4 110 Utility Station Wagon XS.
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17th Jun 2022 3:03pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17382
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You've a long way to go yet, based on your photo. You need to remove the lash adjusters, camshaft carrier, the two camshafts, then the head. I would suggest that you follow this link and in the second post down you'll find a link, courtesy of forum legend dgardel, to the workshop manual for the Puma (both 2.4 and 2.2 versions are available). Download a copy of the manual and at least you will know what you are getting into. Last edited by blackwolf on 17th Jun 2022 3:49pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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17th Jun 2022 3:46pm |
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| Dinnu Member Since: 24 Dec 2019 Location: Lija Posts: 3414  
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Have never taken a Puma engine apart, but most modern dual overhead cam engines, you will need to remove the cam shafts to access the head bolts.
I would bring the pistons somewhere half way through the stroke. I do not know if the crank pulley, or somewhere on the flywheel, or some reference to the crank position sensor can indicate where the TDC is located! If the injectors are out you may ‘feel’ the positions of the pistons. If piston 1 and 2 are at the same height then good to proceed. Note: turn the crank shaft slowly. If it binds, turn in the opposite direction. Once pistons are half way down, rotate each camshaft slowly. Feel for any unusual hard stops. You will need to fight against spring pressures. While rotating when if any follower has excessive backlash compared to the others, which could indicate a bent follower. After confirming the above, I would be tempted to put a nee chain in, rotate again by hand and see if you get equal resistance during compression for each cylinder. You should get some compression on every half turn of the engine. Good luck. 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing 2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black |
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17th Jun 2022 3:48pm |
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| Wethering Landy Member Since: 17 Jun 2022 Location: Suffolk Posts: 39
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Dear Everyone
You are all so helpful. I am of course reluctant to have a new engine if I can avoid it as I have bad experience with re-cons. Plus the engine number will change and that could devalue it. I will look at the manual later with a beer. |
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17th Jun 2022 3:59pm |
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| Ads90 Member Since: 16 Jun 2008 Location: Cots-on-the-Wolds Posts: 809 
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I had the same on my Mk5 Cortina too! I was warned it could be toast as I had repeatedly tried to restart it thinking it was just stalled, before my dad suggested I check the cambelt. Had a mate tow me home and I put a new belt on it from Halfords and it ran good as new. |
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17th Jun 2022 4:07pm |
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