 | Home > INEOS Grenadier > BMW B58 Engine |
 
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| Bluest Member Since: 23 Apr 2016 Location: Lancashire Posts: 4206   
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I think that is indeed the petrol they are proposing to use. With investment in IC engines starting to slow it is fascinating to see what the best part of 200 years of engineering evolution and refinement looks like. It's amazing in all that time that nothing has really bettered the piston engine for road transport and it is really only outside forces that forcing its demise. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
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7th Jul 2020 3:19pm |
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| Ads90 Member Since: 16 Jun 2008 Location: Cots-on-the-Wolds Posts: 809 
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'It's amazing in all that time that nothing has really bettered the piston engine for road transport and it is really only outside forces that forcing its demise.'
So far as the motor alone goes, electric beats ICE in every way, and has done for many years - it's just the storage of it's fuel that is holding it back (which might be what you meant, in which case yes I agree!). |
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7th Jul 2020 3:43pm |
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| Bluest Member Since: 23 Apr 2016 Location: Lancashire Posts: 4206
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That's why I said for road transport. I have a petrol Lister stationary engine, who's roll was made obsolete by electric motors probably 70 years ago.
Where we are now with cars is probably where we were steam trains in the 50s. About as good as they can get, but soon to become dinosaurs, in the developed world at least. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS |
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7th Jul 2020 4:10pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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I'd agree if you said energy density of petroleum fuels primarily ; and cost as a second factor.
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7th Jul 2020 4:12pm |
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| discomog Member Since: 09 May 2015 Location: Notts/Lincs Border Posts: 2526 
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It would be good if they fitted the high performance S58 engine variant with its 503hp. That would top the Works V8's 405hp. Defender 90XS SW
Mini Countryman Cooper S Morgan Plus 8 |
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7th Jul 2020 4:50pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Why stop there, the chap in the video above gets over 1000hp out of his.
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7th Jul 2020 5:39pm |
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| Race.it Member Since: 27 Aug 2019 Location: Algeciras Posts: 815  
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One worry is the timing chain is on the reverse. So if timing chain goes it’s engine out to change. Searching for my first Defender...and started just as Covid hit, so talk about timing.
5 months after starting the search I found it, and here is the details |
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7th Jul 2020 8:47pm |
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| Bluest Member Since: 23 Apr 2016 Location: Lancashire Posts: 4206
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I can’t understand why they’d put the chain at the back, must be reason I guess. The worrying thing is BMW don’t have the best of reputations when it comes to timing chains do they? 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
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7th Jul 2020 9:19pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Just trying to read up on this and see if it's an ongoing issue or not.
There's two things that give me hope: The engines involved seen to run from 2006 to 2012 not later; and the repair, even by the independents appears to involve OEM parts ~ "modified chains, guides and tensioners supplied by BMW" http://prestige-german-engines.co.uk/engin...n-failure/ |
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8th Jul 2020 6:21am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Best I've found "Keeping the chains on the opposite end from the belt driven accessories keeps the engine as short as possible." https://motoiq.com/the-new-supra-engine-mi...-m-engine/ So a packaging issue. |
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9th Jul 2020 6:33am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17360 
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^^ Without explanation that statement isn't particularly satisfactory, since you might reasonably expect the sum of the parts to be the same irrespective of the order. It seems to me more likely that it was someone's innovative good idea which has turned out to be flawed.
That being said, it shouldn't matter since timing chains shouldn't break, go back a few decades and it was unheard of (but engines tended to be over-engineered then). I would be more interested to know why BMW timing chains stretch and break in this day and age, that is inexcusable. I am surprised at the cost of a ful rebuild in the link in the post above, up to £3k for a BMW engine seems cheap compared to, say, a TDCi Defender engine. This reminds me of Ettore Bugatti, who at one time was so adamant that his valves would never need servicing that his engines did not have removable cylinder heads. He was wrong too. |
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9th Jul 2020 7:54am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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My assumption (dangerous, I know) was it allows it to use an otherwise unutilised space at the rear of the crank which it not available at the front.
Perhaps, this is a better explanation? "On the N54/55 engine, they place the alternator, AC compressor, timing chain and engine oil filter assembly towards the front portion of the engine, therefore the engine’s centre of gravity tends to be front-biased. However the B58 treats this differently by placing the oil filter and its radiator, VANOS timing chain at the back of the engine. Therefore improving the weight distribution, however this comes with a price when it comes to added maintenance difficulty." https://stsupercarsblog.wordpress.com/2017...the-party/ |
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9th Jul 2020 9:20am |
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| Banbury Member Since: 22 Jan 2019 Location: Oxfordshire Posts: 47 
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I had the N47 engine and this had the timing chain issue. You know when it is going to go as it has this horrible tick'ing noise.
Loads of us on babybmw.net had issues. BMW would not officially recognize it as a fault. Many replaced the whole timing chain kit. Some lucky folks had a contribution from their BMW dealer - towards labour etc. That being said the view is that the B58 is more robust. Many have put a lot of miles on the B58 and plenty have had them tuned/ chipped without issues. As long as you serviced it and many used shorter intervals for oil changes... |
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9th Jul 2020 12:09pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Curious to read this:
"BMW: all-new gasoline, diesel engines coming to meet stricter regulations On the contrary, a new generation of six- and eight-cylinder powertrains is coming sooner rather than later as a preemptive decision to comply with increasingly stricter emissions regulations. In an extended interview with Auto Motor und Sport, the automaker’s development boss Frank Weber announced much cleaner ICEs are on their way. He pointed out “state-of-the-art internal combustion engines” are necessary to comply with tougher CO2 laws, which is why BMW will respond with powertrains featuring completely different cylinder heads. Weber said nothing will be really the same as it was before when referring to the changes between the two generations of engines. https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/01/13/bmw-new...es-coming/ |
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14th Jan 2022 6:36am |
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