 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > How do I stop this bolt falling out ? |
 
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| bear100 Member Since: 22 Mar 2010 Location: South Wales Posts: 1917   
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Have you used threadlock? i use the Rocol blue.
There are different strengths and will certainly help you, Cheap enough and stocked in Halfrauds]  2016 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 TDV8
2010 110 XS Utility 2.4TDCI 2010 Range Rover Sport TDV8 (gone) 2007 Discovery HSE TDV6 (gone) 1993 110 csw 200 tdi (gone) 1994 90 HT 300 tdi (gone) 1994 discovery 300tdi (gone) 90 hybrid 3.5 v8 (gone) Range rover bobtail 3.5 v8 (gone) |
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7th May 2020 8:33am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17427  
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You probably won't stop it falling out. The problem is that it screws into a blind hole tapped into the cast-iron exhaust manifold, which is (a) fragile and (b) subject to a huge range of temperatures. Given the different coefficients of thermal expansion between the CI manifold and the steel screw, it is almost inevitable that it will keep coming loose. Eventually you will find that repeated tightening and the general unsuitability of CI to hold a thread means that the thread in the manifold will fail, and then you either need a new manifold (the dealer solution) or you simply throw the setscrew away and bend the parts slightly to stop the rattle (the pragmatic approach).
I have been running without this screw for around 150k miles now, the intermittent rattle is the only downside. I did investigate fitting a threaded insert (Helicoil or Timesert) to the manifold but the hole is ridiculously shallow and it really cannot be done without drilling through into an exhaust passage, which is probably not a good idea. I doubt that there is a threadlocking compound that will withstand the heat of an exhaust manifold, although I would be happy to be proved wrong on this. I have toyed with the idea of making a bracket that attaches somewhere else to support this (for example, the bolts/studs that hold the manifold to the head) but I've never actually got around to trying, it has never reached the top of the list of priorities. It will be interesting to see if anyone else has found a solution to this idiotic piece of sloppy design. |
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7th May 2020 8:56am |
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| Joe the Plumber Member Since: 18 Dec 2013 Location: Midlands Posts: 907 
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You could try a very slightly longer bolt with a spring washer under the head.
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7th May 2020 9:36am |
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| Avelingporter Member Since: 25 Jan 2016 Location: Southampton Posts: 405 
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Use graphite powder mixed with a small amount of engine oil to form a paste. Use this as a thread lock. It’s what we use on steam engines. The oil burns off and the graphite sets hard.
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7th May 2020 12:17pm |
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| CharlieDonuts Member Since: 16 Jun 2019 Location: Illiers Combray Posts: 133  
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Thank you for the explanation Blackwolf and other forum members for their the interesting ideas. I was particularly taken by the Isambard Kingdom Brunel 'steam' solution but was a bit worried that I might not ever get the bolt out again. There is a gasket down there that I have had to change, that I need to change again now and no doubt will need to change in the future. I have tried the springy washer before and it fell out. So I am thinking that I might try this.
https://tdsna.henkel.com/americas/na/adhes...422-EN.pdf If the High Temperature Loctite doesn't do it I'll give Isambard a whirl and if that doesn't work I'll go back to not caring  |
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8th May 2020 5:28pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17427
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Unfortunately I can't follow that link (it requires a login), so can you say how high a temperature the high temperature Loctite is good to?
Working hard the exhaust manifold could exceed 400 degrees Celsius and it would be pretty impressive threadlock to cope with this. |
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8th May 2020 5:56pm |
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| MC84 Member Since: 22 May 2016 Location: Near Bristol Posts: 360 
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Like it Mike
Hard Top 90 TD5 2001 Ford 100e 1959 www.youtube.com/mikemakesit |
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8th May 2020 6:17pm |
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| ickle Member Since: 22 Jul 2010 Location: South Vendee Posts: 1785 
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Drill the head crossways and wire it aviation style?
Keith |
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8th May 2020 6:28pm |
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| CharlieDonuts Member Since: 16 Jun 2019 Location: Illiers Combray Posts: 133
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Loctite® 2422™ Ultra High Temperature Threadlocker Blue
https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/kr/en/pro..._2422.html Here is the URL there is another link to a PDF They have only tested it up to 350 C Dunno what do think Steam Engine Method ? |
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8th May 2020 7:06pm |
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| CharlieDonuts Member Since: 16 Jun 2019 Location: Illiers Combray Posts: 133
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 Click image to enlarge Maybe this ? Its not to hard to get to this bolt so I ought to be able to get it ought again with a breaker bar. |
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9th May 2020 9:23am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17427
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That should certainly provide the heat performance you need, impressive!
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9th May 2020 10:23am |
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| bear100 Member Since: 22 Mar 2010 Location: South Wales Posts: 1917
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Thread lock is the way! 2016 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 TDV8
2010 110 XS Utility 2.4TDCI 2010 Range Rover Sport TDV8 (gone) 2007 Discovery HSE TDV6 (gone) 1993 110 csw 200 tdi (gone) 1994 90 HT 300 tdi (gone) 1994 discovery 300tdi (gone) 90 hybrid 3.5 v8 (gone) Range rover bobtail 3.5 v8 (gone) |
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9th May 2020 5:05pm |
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