 | Home > Maintenance & Modifications > Madman EMS2 install - oil pressure plumbing |
 
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1845  
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Evening all,
In the best forum traditions I'm going to post my question, and then start looking for the answer (I have at least had a quock search to find the post I thought had the info, but it didn't) 300Tdi - I'm about to fit the oil pressure gubbins for my Madman EMS2. Hopefully tomorrow, but a quick look at the various bits I have is puzzling. Here's what I have to work with (sorry it's a bit dark):  Click image to enlarge There are actually two new oil sensors here - top right, the analogue one that came with the kit, and the gold/bronze thing bottom left which is the newer 'solid state' alternative. It's not immediately obvious how this would all work. First thoughts are that the 'male/male' adapter would go into the filter housing, where the original oil pressure switch goes; that this original switch then screws into one of the female ports in the T piece; and finally that the 'solid state' oil pressure sensor from madman would go into the other. Sorted! Unfortunately, the 'male/male' adapter seems to have two tapered threads (it's possible that one of these is straight - hard to make out). This means it's not a good fit into the oil filter housing, and certainly doesn't go as far in as the original switch, which requires a sealing washer. Then, the two oil pressure switches (madman and original) don't fit very well into the tapered female threads of the T piece, maybe only 3 or 4 of the threads engaging. Just doesn't feel very secure at all. So either I've got the wrong kit, or the "barely engaged threads" are in fact the proper install. Worst case scenario tomorrow is that I ignore the madman temporarily and just fit the original switch. I am going to ask 4x4 overlander and Madman themselves, but I thought I'd see if there was any relevant experience here, maybe someone who's had the same issue? Thanks Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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27th Jan 2020 8:00pm |
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| donmacn Member Since: 06 Nov 2017 Location: Nth Scotland Posts: 1845
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Hi Simon,
'Yes and no' would be the best way to describe it! I'm quite happy I have the info to proceed, but haven't got there yet! I wanted to fit this as part of the engine going back in, but because I didn't have the information to hand, we just fitted the standard set-up, and I was going to put the madman sender and T piece in when I dropped out the running-in oil. That was before coronavirus.... and I still haven't clocked up my 500/1000 miles. Anyway, I got a good and clear response from madman, which I'll copy below - I don't think there's any real harm in that. For the answer to make sense, you might need the question. It kind of mirrors what's above, but just in case it's different in its wording. Question: "Focussing on the oil pressure side, I'm not sure how to complete this with the kit I have. I did look on the madman site to see if I could find instructions - but I couldn't find anything which dealt with my specific issues. I have a brass T piece with three female threads. These appear to be tapered, both visually, and also because whatever I try and thread into them only goes in by 3 or 4 threads before stopping. I have a male/male adapter. Again it's hard to be sure, this might have two tapered threads, or one tapered and one straight. Then I have three oil pressure sensors/switches; the original LR one; an analogue VDO sensor; and the 'upgraded' solid state 'madman' sensor (7bar). The most intuitive/obvious route is to thread the male/male adaptor into the oil filter housing, thread the t piece onto this, and then thread in the original switch and the new madman sensor. But none of this feels good: the male/male adaptor (apparently tapered) does not go well into the oil filter housing (a straight thread); the T piece doesn't fit well onto the adaptor; and neither sensor fits well into the other two T piece threads. The best match of all the bits I have is between the analogue VDO sensor which came with the kit, and the T piece - these match up pretty well, with the threads engaging to a suitable depth, but of course I was hoping to fit the improved 'madman' sensor. So, I'm left wondering if the bits I have are incompatible? Should there be an alternative T piece with threads to match the new 'madman' solid state sensor and the original LR one? Or is it acceptable that the threads on both of these latter items only partially engage? I would say that I (and the professional mechanic who's helping me with the engine install) have only wound them in finger tight. Perhaps if we used a spanner, the threads would engage more, but it just doesn't feel right, hence the question." And the answer from Brian at Madman: "You are correct in all you say... The Brass female tee is a bit short to fit the Tdi housing and clear everything, so the steel nipple is used to move it out a bit. The Tdi oil hosing and OEM pressure switch is seemingly a M10x1 or 1/8 BSP (Paralell thread) The Tee and both pressure sensors are meant to be 1/8 NPT (Taper thread) The VDO is generally a smaller tip than the others that's why it goes in a bit further, but all are technically the same. You can safely screw the 7 bar sensor and steel nipple into the Tee. Use a bit of loctite just for kicks. While it is not strictly correct, the OEM pressure switch will screw into the Tee and seal. The steel nipple will screw into the oil filter housing and seal - A taper into a straight is more accepted in industry than a straight male into a tape female thread. The actual threads being different is not a major concern as both 1/8ths have the same pitch and the M10x1 has a TPI of 25.7 while the 1/8ths have a tpi of 27 which is non-damaging. It is not strictly correct but it seals and is reliable - I do plan to have exactly the correct threads in future, but this requires the correct fittings to be machined as they are not commercially available." I can't really do any better than that - passing on that detailed response. Hopefully this will allow you to proceed? Please come back and let me know how you get on, or if this doesn't provide what you're looking for. Donald 1994 Defender 300Tdi 110 SW - owned since 2002 - 230k miles and going strong (The 'rolling restoration' or tinkering thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic58538.html ) 2000 Range Rover P38 4.0L V8 in the past.. RR classic - fitted with 200Tdi 1984 RR classic - V8 with ZF auto box 1993 Discovery 300Tdi not to mention the minis and the Type 2 VW camper... |
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26th Apr 2020 7:42pm |
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| 8619simon Member Since: 04 Nov 2016 Location: North Wales Posts: 247  
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Thats brilliant Donald...Thanks for such a quick and detailed response. I am going to do an oil change in the next few days so will crack on as advised from Brian.
Thanks |
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26th Apr 2020 9:52pm |
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