 | Home > Off Topic > JLR’s Financial woes laid bare |
 
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| discomog Member Since: 09 May 2015 Location: Notts/Lincs Border Posts: 2535   
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....and so say all of us. Defender 90XS SW
Mini Countryman Cooper S Morgan Plus 8 |
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5th Apr 2020 3:05pm |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3566 
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Can’t argue with any of that
The world will be different post Covid-19 and only the agile will prosper. We will see whether the boards of many companies were justified in the employment and eye watering salaries of their top Managers and Executives when things start getting back to normal. Anyone can run a business in the good times. It takes someone extremely skilled to return a profit when the worlds back is up against the wall. |
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5th Apr 2020 3:16pm |
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| Swine&Small Member Since: 20 Mar 2017 Location: Norfolk Posts: 1223
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The world will be different post Covid-19 and only the agile will prosper.
 1983 Series 3 Pick up in Marine Blue
1967 Morris Traveller 1966 Morris Convertible 2012 VW T5 Camper Quod Abundat Non Obstat. |
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5th Apr 2020 3:25pm |
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| Procta Member Since: 03 Dec 2016 Location: Sunderland Posts: 5236
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its going to take a good while before this ride is over sadly,
 I work in production for car parts and there was talk about us been out of action till at least the end of may Then when things pick up we could be on a 2 day week. Until things really start to pick up again. I know 2019 was bad year for me and a lot of people, But i have to say 2020 is a lot worse, with uncertainty right across the board. A lot of people have lost their lives to this killer, which i think is a lot worse than they 1st thought. Defender TD5 90 ---/--- Peugeot 306 HDI hatch back
Success is 90% Inspiration and 4 minutes Preparation # you can make it! |
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5th Apr 2020 4:22pm |
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| Swine&Small Member Since: 20 Mar 2017 Location: Norfolk Posts: 1223
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and things can only get worse 1983 Series 3 Pick up in Marine Blue
1967 Morris Traveller 1966 Morris Convertible 2012 VW T5 Camper Quod Abundat Non Obstat. |
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5th Apr 2020 4:24pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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Just a reminder that the current bod can hardly be accused of that ~ he spent and created a company that was supposed to deliver 1m vehicles per annum and then only delivered half...and that half is costing a small fortune in warranty costs, he has no real electric vehicles in production (outsourcing 17k vehicles per annum really doesn't count) and diesel engine variants appear to be extremely poorly engineered. |
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5th Apr 2020 6:06pm |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3566
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Fair comment Supacat
But you see what I am trying to get at? You're right, he hasn't brought much to the party. |
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5th Apr 2020 7:34pm |
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| Procta Member Since: 03 Dec 2016 Location: Sunderland Posts: 5236
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i recon this new defender is sort of future or bust like, Defender TD5 90 ---/--- Peugeot 306 HDI hatch back
Success is 90% Inspiration and 4 minutes Preparation # you can make it! |
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5th Apr 2020 10:52pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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There's a other take from that article, it states the new Defender is together with the Range Rover JLR's most profitable models ~ so you are paying more for style and brand and less for substance.
You are getting quite literally less for your money. |
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6th Apr 2020 6:01am |
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| DSC-off Member Since: 16 Oct 2014 Location: North East Posts: 1444 
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That's what I picked up from the article too.
£60k vehicle, built in a low cost country, and a subsidised new plant. Expected to be one of the most profitable models in the range. |
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6th Apr 2020 7:49am |
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| Grenadier Member Since: 23 Jul 2014 Location: The foot of Mont Blanc... Posts: 5878  
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As I’ve mentioned in other posts, the new Def does not meet the requirements of the majority of its current users (military, medical, NGO, overlander, farmer, utilities, hobbyist looking for character, DIYer etc etc), so the vast majority will be sold to a completely new audience. Some may already be Green Oval fans, moving over from or adding to Discos, RRs etc. But I suspect the vast majority will be new new. So who will they be?
I think we mostly agree they will be wealthy urbanites with aspirations of being Bear Grylls. But how many of those are there, actually? And when they’ve all bought a New Def, who else is going to be buying them in the numbers needed? Currently, loads of fashionistas will be pushing to the front of the queue to buy one, but surely the novelty of a vast, not very pretty, very expensive and not very urban vehicle will wear off. There is a risk that once the hype has settled, the new Def will become as niche as a G Wagen, topped up by former Disco owners. But who’s the market in Europe? Germans will buy G Wagen. The rest of Europe either Merc/Beemer/Audi/another JLR model (or if they’re after a ‘proper’ 4x4, Japanese). US will buy Jeep or some other truck, for half the price. Australasia and SA will buy Japanese. Africa will buy Japanese. South America will buy US. Middle East will buy Japanese. And there’s not a fleet in the world who will touch it, given its list price and complexity. Etc etc etc. So, who’s actually going to buy it once the hype has died down? This seems to me like a flawed exercise to make the most capable 4x4 ever (job well done), money no object, but without giving any thought to who the long-term, market wide buyer will be. Mark my word, this will be JLR’s G Wagen and they will lose gazillions.  Monsieur Le Grenadier
I've not been everywhere, but it's on my list..... 2011 Puma 110DC - Corris Grey |
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6th Apr 2020 8:17am |
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| Tim in Scotland Member Since: 23 May 2007 Location: The Land that time forgot Posts: 3753 
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Grenadier, you left out the elephant in the room - unless JLR gets a grip of warranty repairs and reliability nobody will be interested in replacing their Merc/Beemer/Toyota/Jeep with any JLR product. They should be using this shut down period to be working out how to improve their attitude to customers and sorting out reliability. Especially they need to give better back up to owners of vehicles between 3 and 10 years old who JLR have basically washed their hands of. If that means dumping component suppliers so be it , they too are contributing to JLR’s reliablity woes if their components are poor quality. Perhaps one thing the Covid 19 episode will highlight is that, even though shipping is still operating seemlessly, the global supply line is extremely fragile when the main supplier to the world (China and SE Asia) has to lockdown and factories close - maybe bringing component manufacturing back closer to home might help and maybe a re-appraisal,of Brexit needs to be considered
On the parts front I have a good German example of what shifting manufacturing did to Miele’s products. I have a Miele washer drier now 15 years old. It has a lifetime warranty. Last year I called out a technician (only the 2nd time in 15 years) because I managed to trip the electronics by using too much detergent that made a lot of foam (I’m a single bloke, we are aren’t programmed not to mix detergents!). The technician came the next morning right on the booked time, took one look at my machine and connected his laptop up to it and performed a reset. Then he said to me - your washing machine is one of the oldest I have come across, you bought it at a very good time because shortly after you bought it the factory in Germany was closed and production was sent to China. I have Miele washing machines now that only last 3-4 years and customers are now not buying them, they are very expensive machines. Management in Germany decided that if they continued with the warranty claims they were facing they soon would be bust, in 2017 they shut down the Chinese factory and brought production back to a new factory in Germany. They can now control every step of production locally and not have to work with a totally inflexible part Government owned company a flight half way round the world to deal with issues. Customers have faith in Mieles product again and in 2019 sales are booming despite the high price of the machines! JLR has to learn that lesson too. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come 2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed! |
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6th Apr 2020 8:34am |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3566
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I agree with everything that is being said, but the one thing which is forgotten. Large companies are run by accountants for the profitability of the owners / share holders. If you can produce something with the illusion of it being a quality product, then get it produced in a far away country for pennies by their cheap workforce, you win the game. Premium clothing manufacturers, sports wear manufacturers, even high end phone and computer companies (you know the one I am on about
 ) have had this business model for years and it makes them and their share holders a fortune. Remember the World Cup replica footballs being sewn together by kids in the Far East?
Where the JLR model is broken is that the business is not making a fortune and it is not making a quality product. Whether the new Defender is going to be a success or not, only time will tell. It’s not getting the best of starts and like Brexit, I am sure failures in many forms by many companies will be blamed on Covid-19 whether or not their business model was broken before all of this or not. See Debenhams for details. |
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6th Apr 2020 9:23am |
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| walfy Member Since: 29 Aug 2007 Location: Frome Posts: 2673
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It's not designed to replace the old Defender. Speaking to a good friend who is the business manager at a dealership, they're predicted sales to current Defender owners is 17% of sales. And that is by design. He said they were after a different segment. For those who think the new Defender is a direct replacement for the old Defender are deluding themselves. There will never be a JLR direct replacement for the old Defender. 110 D250 SE HT 110 USW SOLD RRE HSE Dynamic Gone, wife killed it VOLVO XC60 R Dynamic with some toys Polaris RZR 900XP SOLD |
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8th Apr 2020 1:54pm |
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