 | Home > INEOS Grenadier > Main Grenadier discussion thread |
 
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| Huttopia Member Since: 23 Feb 2016 Location: West Midlands Posts: 1972  
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This is the ad, it says VAT inclusive: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/355192895599?mk...media=COPY
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21st Dec 2023 8:50am |
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| Huttopia Member Since: 23 Feb 2016 Location: West Midlands Posts: 1972
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There’s also 2 seater commercial with 12k on the clock for £47+ vat, so £56k. They are in the same used car market that’s wiping stacks off high end stuff month after month, no reason for them to be immune I guess.
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21st Dec 2023 5:39pm |
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| Mr Fox Member Since: 10 Sep 2011 Location: green & pleasant land Posts: 1037 
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Are there waiting lists? A call to three local Grenadier dealers unearthed more than one new vehicles for sale at each of them. It is also interesting looking at Autotrader, and using the price tracker; this is one example and there are others. I don't believe Ineos are faring any better than other makers.  Click image to enlarge |
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21st Dec 2023 6:07pm |
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| Huttopia Member Since: 23 Feb 2016 Location: West Midlands Posts: 1972
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I hear the customer service function at Ineos is falling apart. Senior people exiting and no sense of responsibility within customer care. It feels like a tipping point, they need to up their game or risk losing existing customers and potential new ones.
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22nd Dec 2023 11:09pm |
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| nebc100 Member Since: 07 Nov 2023 Location: Altlinster Posts: 94 
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From what I have understood here in Luxembourg, there is no waiting list of you can find one that the dealer has already ordered.
We were considering getting one, and they had the exact colour and specs that we wanted in stock. The vehicle was intended for Sweden, but could be diverted to Lux. We were going to order it, but then realised that it was over 2m tall and wouldn't fit in our garage at home or in many of the shopping center parkings that are near us. This was a complete knockout for us, as it would be used for a daily vehicle for my wife on top of being the standard workhorse for me with my horses etc. We went for a D110 P400 instead (cheaper, easier to live with and more comfortable!!) Although I liked the Grenadier, I don't regret getting the D110!! |
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23rd Dec 2023 6:19am |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3498 
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This is in no way being critical of anyone who has a Grenadier (as I would like one if I had the money) but the world is full of entrepreneurs who get good at something and make lots of money. They then decide that they are brilliant at business and can turn their hand to making anything - and then fail. Richard Branson is a prime example. I have lost count of the number of Virgin ****** businesses that he has started up and closed (albeit some Virgin brands are just using the name on licence).
Jim, bless him, has a very successful chemical company. Making cars (or running football clubs) is a completely different skill set and what is being said about the after purchase experience doesn’t surprise me. After all once you have sold chemicals to a customer, it’s not as if he has an experience in after sales service. The Grenadier business model was and is still fraught with challenges. I would never be at all surprised if the Grenadier factory were to close and production cease. Jim has done what he wanted to do but as with JLR with the new Defender, he was late onto the market and has maybe produced a product that doesn’t really have an obvious market other than those people who want one. I may be wrong. That just my thoughts. |
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23rd Dec 2023 10:45am |
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| Huttopia Member Since: 23 Feb 2016 Location: West Midlands Posts: 1972
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I think Jim has done very well to build a vehicle from scratch and get it 90%+ right. As someone I know put it, Land Rovers leave the factory 60% right so what Ineos have done is quite an achievement.
Whether having designed, built and launched the Grenadier the excitement has passed and other new shiny things are a focus is perhaps the issue. Yesterday I was having a beer with someone who runs a mixed portfolio of dealerships including two Ineos outfits. They are dropping them. That’s two out of 24 or 26 nationally, at a time when it should be flying. By all accounts senior execs at Ineos have gone awol, no response to calls, emails etc and customers being left high and dry. A great shame. Hopefully it will be turned around quickly. |
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24th Dec 2023 8:50am |
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| Chicken Drumstick Member Since: 17 Aug 2020 Location: Near MK Posts: 722
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Not sure I follow really. The height of the Grenadier was never hidden. Your whole story could be. Wanted to buy a Lotus, but found out it was too low. So bought a Focus RS instead (cheaper, easier to live with and more comfortable!!) . Ie the new Defender is such a different type of vehicle. It and the Grenadier really aren’t comparable or even direct alternatives. |
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24th Dec 2023 9:12am |
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| lightning Member Since: 23 Apr 2009 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2760
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I don't know.
Both are marketed as a rugged 4x4 for adventures. Both vehicles are fit for purpose, while approaching it from different angles. The main difference is the type of people who will buy them. The Grenadier is likely to be bought by people who will actually use the vehicle for what it was designed for. Although there are exceptions, most Defenders are bought by people who will never take them out of the city, let alone off road. |
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25th Dec 2023 2:58pm |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3498
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/...ed-in-tray
Jim has bigger fish to fry now. And if this article is to be believed, more problems at Old Trafford than a team that doesn't win trophies. Might take his focus away from the Grenadier business? I didn't realise he was 71 years old. I understand that we are all wired differently, and we all have different drivers which make us get out of bed of a morning, but I for one would be choosing my Caribbean island and finding a nice comfy pair of slippers (or flip flops) at 71. But that probably shows why Jim is a multimillionaire, and I'm not  |
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25th Dec 2023 8:54pm |
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| nebc100 Member Since: 07 Nov 2023 Location: Altlinster Posts: 94
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Chicken… please not that I never said the height was “hidden”… but to me it shows that Ineos didn’t really think about the practical side of the Grenadier. Many parkings here in Luxembourg (and Germany and France) have a maximum height of 2m. It is a shame that Ineos didn’t lower the height of the Grenadier by the 3cm so that it was exactly 2m tall, and this would have then included a lot more potential clients.
I could also mention that the road tax for the petrol version is MUCH higher (in Luxembourg… don’t know elsewhere) than the P400 defender. Then there is also the fact that the engine is a BMW engine 
Honestly… the Grenadier was inpressive, and would have fitter my use (REGULAR towing of a 2.7T horse trailer for LONG distances) very well, but the Defender (or my Disco5) also fits this role really well!! Then I should also point out that I managed to get a brand new Def110 XS P400 for less than I would have paid for the Grenadier. I know that the Grenadier can come from factory with a winch, and my Def doesn’t have one, but I plan to put one on myself in a year or so, so I am not concerned about this. I have now driven a couple of thousand KMs in the Def, and am very happy with it!! I hope that anyone that buys the Grenadier is also happy with it!! I hope that Ineos do well with it!! |
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25th Dec 2023 9:05pm |
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| Chicken Drumstick Member Since: 17 Aug 2020 Location: Near MK Posts: 722
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Most cars on sale over the past 100 years have probably 90% cross over with what they do. You have to look at finer details to differentiate them. Ie Both Subaru and Honda sell vehicle that match your tag line. But I would call either of them Defender or Grenadier competitors. Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge |
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26th Dec 2023 11:39am |
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| lightning Member Since: 23 Apr 2009 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2760
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Yep, you're right of course.
People like the idea that their new vehicle could take them to Cape Town, and the advertising often pushes the adventure theme. Sadly all that happens is the owners feel invincible in their chunky SUV and drive far too fast in bad weather, or go out when the MET Office says "stay in" and then get stuck and have to be rescued. l would like to say that l bought my Defender because l am planning off road adventures, but sadly that's not the case. l bought it because l had the old model and liked the look of the new one. The Grenadier is indeed a different prospect. lt's a genuine "made for purpose" off road and adventure wagon. l doubt you'll see many Yummy Mummies at the helm. The off-road designed steering would put them off, as would the climb to get in ("no use for my parents, why didn't it come with air suspension....") For them the new Defender is perfect (and l say this as an owner of one!) Although mine is the Commercial 90 on Steels. Most l see are pristine with not a spot of mud on the sides. Both vehicles have a market. l would have loved a Grenadier but the figures didn't add up for me. Plus it would have been wasted....the furthest l go off road is to farms and across fields in my work. |
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28th Dec 2023 6:47pm |
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| lightning Member Since: 23 Apr 2009 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2760
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Land Rover ran a great advertisement for the old Defender, towards the end of production when people were buying the special editions as "lifestyle choices"
ln a house the family are stood in the hall. Outside a storm rages and the door rattles with the wind. "Okay" says the dad, "l am going to get a Chinese takeaway now" Fear fills the face of his young son, and a tear runs down his face. "Don't worry" says dad "l'm taking the Defender" With that his son's face changes and the fear is gone. He knows that his dad will be fine. |
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28th Dec 2023 7:02pm |
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