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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20460

United Kingdom 
They are worse, but they all play they're part in degrading everyone's lifestyle and taking every bit of fun anyone could have away.
Look at legal green laning for example....
Post #532649 18th May 2016 1:51pm
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Cupboard



Member Since: 21 Mar 2014
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 2971

United Kingdom 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Corris Grey
I could stand to be proved wrong but I'm pretty sure the trailer rules aren't an EU thing.
The agricultural trailer rules definitely aren't, I can buy and drive a tractor and trailer in Germany that's perfectly legal and break a different set of rules in each EU country I drive it through to bring it home.

EU's not perfect but don't blanket blame everything on them Smile

As for caravans, if you want to tow a caravan with a B+E then buy a small car. Simple. Something like a Jeep Renegade has an MAM of around 2t and a towing capacity of 1.5t and a quick bit of research shows quite a few caravans that fall within that.
Ford Focus, Kia Sportage and I'm sure many others are the same.
Post #532656 18th May 2016 2:11pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20460

United Kingdom 
A lot of the lighting rules are EU related for example though, some defy sense in certain cases.

Many laws with grey areas as to say no one, not even the authorities know right and wrong with.

These days one minute your doing everything by the book and no problem, the next you could be prosecuted for doing the same thing a year later and no one is even made aware of any changes.

If safety on the roads is such an issue why is it they are more bothered about an 'E' mark on a light lense than a damn great pothole that could kill someone by causing them to loose control.

It's all about money, us paying more, them saving more and paying out less.
That goes across the board from the EU to the UK system.
Post #532661 18th May 2016 2:20pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17457

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
miker wrote:
blackwolf wrote:
custom90steve wrote:
Pretty much, wonder who created said rules too


That would be our European masters.

Vote "out" in the referendum and it could all change to something sensible, simple, and intelligible.


Just like all the british politicians are sensible, simple and intelligible, right? Laughing


I did say "could", not "will". It could just as likely get worse! Big Cry

I thought that the changes to the UK driving entitlements were due to a desire to bring the UK regulations in line with Europe, but I may be wrong. I am lucky, I got my licence in the 1970s and have B, BE, C, CE, as well as C1 and C1E and various other things I now forget, so trailers etc aren't really an issue. I can also make the young folk a tad green by pointing out that I went straight from a car licence to an HGV1 because in those days that's how it was. Very Happy

I have long maintained that any person who actually wants to become a politician should be banned from doing so (in fact probably incarcerated somewhere) since generally such people are fundamentally unsuited to the job.

I have no intention however of being drawn into a discussion on politics since (a) forum rules prevent it (thank goodness) and (b) I wouldn't give the time of day to any politician at the moment, I have such a low opinion of them!
Post #532680 18th May 2016 3:28pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20460

United Kingdom 
Yes, keep politics separate.
Back on issue concerned, I put all these things down as reasons as to why younger people aren't interested in taking up such jobs.
That is my concern for the future, far too much red tape.
And even if you do get over the hurdles. (And can afford to) chances are there won't be a job.
Often you hear if shortages here and there and then if anyone tried to get said work they'd be turned away. Rolling Eyes
Post #532683 18th May 2016 3:36pm
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chopcat



Member Since: 11 Sep 2012
Location: Pembrokeshire
Posts: 412

Wales 2000 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Java Black
So can someon help me on this

My globemaster has a breakaway cable for the brakes but also a retention chain to keep the think attached in the event of a hitch failure.= by dropping it over the ball.

I am told by the company that sold me the trailer that it is illegal to have the chain over the ball hook.

Is it and why?

CC
Post #532703 18th May 2016 4:50pm
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Cupboard



Member Since: 21 Mar 2014
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 2971

United Kingdom 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Corris Grey
it's bad practice to have the breakaway cable (the thing that pulls the brake on) attached to the tow ball because it can come off, and if the tow ball were to part company from the tow vehicle the breakaway cable would go with it and fail to do anything useful.

I've never come across a chain to stop the thing escaping if the hitch fails, but I'd guess it was for the same reason. If the ball falls off, the chain's useless.
Post #532705 18th May 2016 4:55pm
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Romadog



Member Since: 07 Jul 2011
Location: Powys
Posts: 1749

Chopcat - The breakaway cable should be connected to the vehicle to activate the brake mechanism should the trailer hitch come off the ball. Its not advisable to put the cable around the ball if it is that type of cable and long enough. However the cable can be put round the pin on a ball/pin combination hitch as long as the retaining clips/pins are maintained. The bolts coming away from the tow hitch is less of an issue as its to do with the trailer hitch parting company with the vehicle. The tow hitch frame is bolted to the body or chassis of the tow vehicle so what if they came loose ?!! The bolts should be checked on service and MOT.
You can buy a plate to bolt between the tow ball and vehicle which has a loop that you can connect or loop the cable through, if there isn't a hole as on 13 reg transits - no-one at Ford seem to have an answer, but towbar manufacturers tell me that they have to have a hole to pass type approval.

http://www.ate-uk.com/vehicle-couplings/ve...acket.html

As far as the chain is concerned that of approved design should be used with unbraked trailers ONLY. They should be of a length so that if the tow hitch detached from the ball it will not dig into the road, but stays attached to the vehicle.

Thumbs Up
Post #532723 18th May 2016 6:51pm
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lambert.the.farmer



Member Since: 11 Apr 2012
Location: harrogate
Posts: 2006

England 1998 Defender 90 300 Tdi PU Rutland Red
Chains are really for unbaked trailers such that in the event of the trailer becoming detached from the hitch the draw bar is kept from digging into the road an flipping the trailer. Also the chain is to keep the prime mover and trailer together in the event of hitch failure as without brakes and a breakaway cable the trailer would otherwise be free to cause any amount of carnage. This is why any secondary means of attachments need to be secured onto something other than the tow ball or jaw. With a braked trailer The idea is that in the event of hitch failure as the prime mover and trailer begin to separate the breakaway cable automatically applies the trailer brakes full on and the trailer comes to a fairly immediate stop. Also on single axle braked trailers the draw bar is obliged to have some forms of skid to prevent it digging into the road and flipping. It is however not appropriate to use a chain on a braked trailer as a means of preventing the draw bar digging in as it will remove the functionality of the breakaway cable in stopping the trailer independently of the prime mover. Rhubarb and custard let fly with their secret weapon.
Post #532737 18th May 2016 7:15pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 17457

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
I like to use both the breakaway cable and a chain when towing a braked trailer, but the chain must be long enough to allow the breakaway cable to do its job before the chain pulls taut. What I usually do is bunch up the chain on a cable tie which would break and allow a lot of slack to allow the breakaway cable to pull the brakes on then part, before the chain is tight.

It gives me peace of mind because I feel if the trailer did come off it will still tend to follow and there might be some ability to steer it as the vehicle and trailer comes to a stand.
Post #532816 18th May 2016 9:41pm
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jimbob7



Member Since: 06 Jul 2013
Location: uk
Posts: 2055

LoveTheMud wrote:
So I can't, with my 1999 issued licence, tow a caravan...but my dad, with his old man reactions and poor hearing can? It's ridiculous really,

Category B vehicles with larger trailers i.e. more than 750kg, provided that the combined Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM) does not exceed 3.5 tonnes and the gross MAM of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the towing vehicle.15 Apr 2013

Well guess I will just have to put on my grey wig and drive badly to look like someone safe to tow heavy loads Rolling with laughter


But the authorities are quite right to introduce tougher standards for driving,what is wrong with that? There sensibly, has to be a cut off point,otherwise every car driver would have a bike and HGV license the moment they passed their car test at the age of 15?,cant' be bothered looking for the lowest age over the entire history of driving in the UK,but I would guess 15.Also the number of cars on the road today has made driving at least 100% harder than it was when I passed my test (back end of the 80's). Pov.spec,ftw. 2006, 110,TD5.
Post #532889 19th May 2016 9:19am
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 20460

United Kingdom 
I'd say the test age should be 18 too, even that is young but in line with everything else.

I also find it a bit of a strange that a much higher percentage of females pass first time at a young age than young men.
Especially more so the fact the majority of examiners are middle aged men. Rolling Eyes

Any funny part is I myself had a female examiner that passed me.
But that maybe because she chose me due to taking my 90 for the test. Rolling with laughter Mr. Green
Post #532916 19th May 2016 10:59am
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chopcat



Member Since: 11 Sep 2012
Location: Pembrokeshire
Posts: 412

Wales 2000 Defender 90 Td5 CSW Java Black
blackwolf wrote:
I like to use both the breakaway cable and a chain when towing a braked trailer, but the chain must be long enough to allow the breakaway cable to do its job before the chain pulls taut. What I usually do is bunch up the chain on a cable tie which would break and allow a lot of slack to allow the breakaway cable to pull the brakes on then part, before the chain is tight.

It gives me peace of mind because I feel if the trailer did come off it will still tend to follow and there might be some ability to steer it as the vehicle and trailer comes to a stand.


absolute sense Thumbs Up
Post #532933 19th May 2016 12:17pm
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jimbob7



Member Since: 06 Jul 2013
Location: uk
Posts: 2055

I don't care what the age is,it should be very,very,mega,ultra hard,including night and motorway driving.Which, a Hugh amount of drivers still don't have the hang of. Pov.spec,ftw. 2006, 110,TD5.
Post #532959 19th May 2016 2:49pm
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LoveTheMud



Member Since: 19 Feb 2015
Location: Weybridge Surrey & Pontefract West Yorkshire
Posts: 411

United Kingdom 2014 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Santorini Black
jimbob7 wrote:
LoveTheMud wrote:
So I can't, with my 1999 issued licence, tow a caravan...but my dad, with his old man reactions and poor hearing can? It's ridiculous really,

Category B vehicles with larger trailers i.e. more than 750kg, provided that the combined Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM) does not exceed 3.5 tonnes and the gross MAM of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the towing vehicle.15 Apr 2013

Well guess I will just have to put on my grey wig and drive badly to look like someone safe to tow heavy loads Rolling with laughter


But the authorities are quite right to introduce tougher standards for driving,what is wrong with that? There sensibly, has to be a cut off point,otherwise every car driver would have a bike and HGV license the moment they passed their car test at the age of 15?,cant' be bothered looking for the lowest age over the entire history of driving in the UK,but I would guess 15.Also the number of cars on the road today has made driving at least 100% harder than it was when I passed my test (back end of the 80's).


I'm not disagreeing, just that when the same logic is applied to pensions or job contracts, there is an awful lot of spilt milk Shocked
Post #532963 19th May 2016 3:11pm
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