 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Failing synchromesh in 2nd? |
 
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| Nevillerover Member Since: 14 Feb 2015 Location: Suffolk Posts: 224   
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Changed the oil in mine at 150K miles and it certain,y helped, still a bit of a grind into 2nd tho when cold. I think it's a characteristic. Make sure you use the correct oil! And only 2.2 litres.
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27th Aug 2015 11:48am |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20620
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As above, think they are all a little like that when cold.
I'd just try making it a little bit of a lighter gear change and not quite so quick. |
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27th Aug 2015 11:50am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17610 
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I find that the MT82 1st to 2nd change is the complete opposite of the ghastly R380 (TD5) 1st to 2nd change, ie on the MT82 is leisurely when cold, faster when hot. On the R380 it has to be lightning fast when cold and is slow when hot.
I can't myself understand why anyone prefers the R380 to the MT82, personally I think that the former is one of the most horrible gearboxes Landrover has ever used, and the latter is one of the best in terms of driveability. Shame it is let down by the Cadbury clutch and the poor (dry) assembly of the output shaft, though the latter is easy to resolve. (Best of all I think was the early S2 box with big bearings and no synchro on 1st, 2nd and reverse. A good change under all conditions and very strong.) |
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27th Aug 2015 1:19pm |
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| ian series 1 Member Since: 17 Nov 2014 Location: south Posts: 3127 
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Cheers guys.
Glad it's not just mine with a crunch! It's only bad when cold first thing in the morning, once it's warmed up it disappears. Just wasn't too sure if it was just me? I will still give it an oil change, can't do no harm  80" 80" 86" 88" 90"
Wanted, Forward Control Anything considered. |
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27th Aug 2015 4:32pm |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 20620
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Oil change should help as mentioned above.
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27th Aug 2015 5:38pm |
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| PumaPhil Member Since: 26 Oct 2014 Location: Bridgend Posts: 201  
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My 2015 Puma at 12000 miles has just gone back to the dealer with the same problem, although it sounds like it could be a bit worse as 1st to 2nd is very hard to engage no matter how warm the oil is, the 110 I've had as a loan is completely different. I'll let you know the outcome...
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27th Aug 2015 8:00pm |
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| YOLO110 Member Since: 14 Feb 2015 Location: Perth Oz and Stansted UK Posts: 1646 
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I too have had this on both my new Puma's...
 YOLO... You Only Live Once... |
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27th Aug 2015 9:26pm |
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| Td5 Member Since: 29 Jun 2015 Location: Finland Posts: 53  
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Perhaps you should read the story about similar problems in Ford Mustang?
It won't solve your problem, but you know more when you hear the explanation from Land Rover. http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic39663.html Same transmission is used also in other Ford's, Transit at least, haven't checked if there are some problems there also. The Mustang MT82 is made in China?, if I de-chipered my transmission sticker correctly, mine is made in UK, Ford Getrag Haleood plant, so they might not be identical. The transmission, at least the Mustang version, seem to be critical about what lubrication is used, at least this is what I got from all these writings. But, I'm known to be wrong... Brgds, Juha '96 300Tdi 90 '07 Puma 90 |
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28th Aug 2015 4:46am |
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| Erik256 Member Since: 05 Mar 2013 Location: Tallinn Posts: 26  
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Hi! My first post, but a long time lurker in the forum. To be honest gearbox was the reason I found this forum. I've had "issues" with my Defenders gearbox from the beginning. I bought mine 2nd hand on its last months of warranty (mileage 40 000 km) and the first repair that was made to my car was a new gearbox under warranty. My complaint was exactly this, that the gear change from first to second was notchy. The dealer informed me that the synchros were knackered and they had decided to replace the whole gearbox. Not really familiar with the car I probably didn't pay enough attention to the difference afterward. Thinking back on it now I think the gear change actually did not improve much. I downplayed the issue assuring myself that the box needed some time to run itself in, but after another 10 000 km I was starting to notice the issue. In my case the change from 1st to 2nd is the worst. Also 2nd to 3rd is not smooth. 1st to 2nd is very notchy when done even in normal speed (not to mention a fast change). If changed really slowly and with practice one can accomplish a silent change. The trouble is that with such a slow change its impossible to keep up with other traffic. Interestingly my gearbox is on its worst when the oil is warm. Since I ran out of warranty I have tried to remedy this with the help of my indie. I have had the clutch changed, tried different oils and additives, have adjusted the clutch pedal many times, tried to drive it with or without floor mats (a suggestion I got from this forum) and finally changed the 2nd and 3rd gear syncros again. All to no effect. So I'm definitely certain that the gearbox design is flawed. This is my first defender so I don't have anything to compare it to, but my indie says that they all do it (Pumas I'm mean) and mine is actually a relatively smooth one. I've also heard that Transits, which share the basic gearbox design, also suffer from poor gear change, but cannot confirm for this myself.
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28th Aug 2015 6:55pm |
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| Nevillerover Member Since: 14 Feb 2015 Location: Suffolk Posts: 224
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With practice it gets better. I usually pull away in 1st with no throttle, as my foot comes off the clutch I depress the gas a. Bit and then Once it's rolling, slowly into 2nd. After a few miles. I can be a bit more enthusiastic with the box. You'll get used to it I'm sure.
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28th Aug 2015 7:03pm |
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| Erik256 Member Since: 05 Mar 2013 Location: Tallinn Posts: 26
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You're right. With practice it does get better. Its just frustrating to read that some people don't have this issue while others have. Or is it that some just don't care. Poor gear change or not I still wouldn't change my Defender for anything else.
Still. I might try the recommendations from the Mustang forum next oil change. |
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28th Aug 2015 7:16pm |
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| Jonno Member Since: 06 Mar 2012 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 234 
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Mine is the same and always has been.
It is however much worse on a cold day or if the car has been parked up for a week or so. After a lay up it usually takes 2 miles or so and it gradually gets better. I suspect something in the top of the box is draining dry of oil. Jonno Last edited by Jonno on 29th Aug 2015 6:56pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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28th Aug 2015 7:44pm |
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| Nevillerover Member Since: 14 Feb 2015 Location: Suffolk Posts: 224
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For the record let me explain that I have had a company car for many years. Free* fuel, free* servicing ' perfectly operating and maintained etc etc and I'm very grateful for it but, and it's a big but, I'd rather drive my Landie or any of the other Landies I've had regardless of thier foibles. To drive a Landie of any age without clunking, grinding or graunching is a life skill that once learn't, elevates you to a special club that ordinary mortals don't even realise exists.
*i have to pay the tax man for this. |
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28th Aug 2015 9:58pm |
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| millepet Member Since: 01 Apr 2013 Location: Wijnendale Posts: 33  
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Double declutching from first to second is what I do if the gearbox is cold. Once warm, its OK to change straight from 1 to 2. I have read that an additive could be the solution.
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7th Jan 2018 5:36pm |
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