 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > TDCi heater control valve options |
 
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| Linds Hanson Member Since: 16 Jan 2021 Location: Cornwall Posts: 486  
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That's a justifiable excuse for the Tdi engined Defender but everything since has become much harder to fix road side or in the workshop yet still retains crappy 60's qaulity core parts. Since the end of production JLR have consistently taken the ####with parts prices plucked out of the stratosphere! |
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8th Apr 2023 10:34am |
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| materoforion Member Since: 01 Dec 2021 Location: Melbourne Posts: 3  
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 Click image to enlarge Hey! Jus wanted to credit @newhue for the great idea. I have 110 Puma and I was on my 3rd Heater valve and I've had enough. Googled and found this thread and tried it out. I can confirm that this heater valvel works, the cabling I still have to work on but the interim solution works (in reverse order). Just tested this setup for 50kms, will try to update longevity of this setup. For anyone interested, here's some links from the items I used. Heater valve - https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/253917762669 I've puchased OEM like valves, and here's the link to that valve - https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/402906245688 Hit me up if there's any questions. Click image to enlarge |
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16th Apr 2023 2:19am |
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| Naks Member Since: 27 Jan 2009 Location: Stellenbosch, ZA Posts: 2638  
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Workshop fitted a brand new LR part, and guess what? After 80km on the highway, hot air is blowing everywhere even with the fan off. FFS. When I looked at the new part and one in another Puma, it is obvious that the part design has changed. This is both parts fully closed, you can see the new one has less travel than the old one, i.e., when the olf one is fully closed, the pivot arm is almost horizontal. Not so on the new part, and even when you press it down manually, it doesn't go anywhere near as horizontal as the old one. New part: Click image to enlarge Old part: Click image to enlarge -- 2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear 2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged
Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9 Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ |
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16th Apr 2023 6:38am |
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| Naks Member Since: 27 Jan 2009 Location: Stellenbosch, ZA Posts: 2638
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I can't get that Commodore part here in ZA, but maybe I can use this Ford Transit one?
For Ford Transit MK7 2.2 2.4 3.2 TDCI 2006- Air/con Heater Control Valve: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/393628365302 Click image to enlarge -- 2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear 2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged
Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9 Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ |
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16th Apr 2023 7:21am |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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When you say it’s working in reverse order I assume that’s because you have fitted the valve the wrong way round and it needs to rotate 180 degrees to work normally. Any reason you did that ? Edit- or the valve you purchased is set up in the reverse way to the one you need . The one you need should operate like newhue’s one. Last edited by Ianh on 19th Apr 2023 12:00pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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17th Apr 2023 11:09pm |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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I’ve been doing a bit of investigating on potential options.
Here is what I’ve found. Their is a USA company that makes and sells these four port bypass valves including electronically controlled motorised ones 
They have been in business since 1964, which is always a good sign. https://www.thermotion.com/electronic-heat...trol-valve Here is their catalogue https://www.thermotion.com/pdf/Master_Heat...atalog.pdf There are other companies that do the same but they don’t look as good quality valves , motors and control modules. The reason I like the motorised valve is it does away with the cabling making it a much more tidy install and provides total control. You would need the valve and motor , plus the control module, plus a 10 KΩ Potentiometer and a fused battery feed and earth. Plus make some small bracket to fit valve to existing bracket. What I’m now looking at is how the standard rotary heating control in the Puma dash can be adapted from rotating the control cable to rotating the potentiometer to control the heat. Which will need to cover how to attach the two and matching the rotation of the potentiometer with the full blue to red rotation of the rotary heating control in the dash. I’ve not looked at this yet so it may be a show stopper. Just wanted to share my idea and get peoples feedback. |
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17th Apr 2023 11:49pm |
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| hornet Member Since: 04 Jan 2010 Location: Western Europe Posts: 361 |
Interesting idea, but why not rotating the poti directly with the heater control, no need to rotate the control and then translate the linear movement into rotation ....?!
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19th Apr 2023 6:03am |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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Hi Hornet - my fault, I did not explain it well. What you suggest is what I’m looking at. I.e removing the cable mechanism behind the heater control dial then connecting the potentiometer to the dial directly.
I just need to work out if that can be done without destructive modifications so a return can be made to default current setup without needing a new heater control. |
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19th Apr 2023 11:50am |
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| hornet Member Since: 04 Jan 2010 Location: Western Europe Posts: 361 |
Thanks, I think I misunderstood it
I have no experience in these things, but the travel of the genuine knob is ~180°, most of the potis use 270° range. That means one could use a maximum of ~70% of the adjustment possible. If that is not enough, the challenge is to find a solution/poti with 180° range.... |
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20th Apr 2023 7:09am |
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| skidrov Member Since: 06 Oct 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 55 
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Ok, think I can see where this is going... 🙂
So if you control the valve with a potentiometer, it's a small step to add in a thermistor and have climate control.... |
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20th Apr 2023 7:38am |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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Hornet. Agree on the rotation of the Potentiometer, finding a quality 5 or 10k Ohm pot that can handle the amps ( 300ma max, so not huge) and has the right spindle diameter, length etc is something I’m searching for.
Skidrov. That’s an interesting future enhancement. The key drivers are getting a better heater valve solution that looks “factory” , is reliable, and provides more control. So I’m looking at two options., cable control and motorised control. Each have pros and cons. So for me on the motorised one it’s focused on identifying the correct potentiometer and seeing how it would fit with the existing heater control. I’m looking to source a cheap second hand Puma heater control on which to build a bench prototype, so if anyone has one please contact me. Looking at the back of the control valve it looks like the spindle coming from the temperature control dial knob has a good size hole in it, about the right size for a potentiometer spindle to fit
See right hand side of picture below. The part currently attached to the spindle, and moved by the spindle cog to in-turn move the cable looks to be detachable.The moulding to the left of the spindle looks a good place to attach a 90 degree bracket on which to mount the potentiometer. so promising but need to get my hands on a spare heater control to validate and prototype. Click image to enlarge |
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20th Apr 2023 12:33pm |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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On the Bowden cable operated valve option , this valve looks promising from old air products in the USA.
https://www.oldairproducts.com/product/25-...ater-valve It’s pull to open and if fitted in our defenders the cable mechanism would be on top and face toward the bulkhead. You would therefore need a longer Bowden cable as the cable would need to bend 90 degrees to connect to it. But longer Bowden cables are relatively easy to source and there seems plenty of room to have a wide radius 90 degrees bend made between the bulkhead and valve mechanism . Also you would need to add a 90 degree 16mm hose to the heater return spigot and then connect that hose to the existing 18mm return hose from the heater matrix using a hose joiner with an 18mm spigot one end and a 16mm the other. Then modify existing valve bracket to allow the matrix return hose to sit under it. The only thing to check is the travel from closed to open, if it’s 26-30mm all should be ok. In the picture the top right spigot is the hot from engine, the top left spigot is input to the heater matrix, the bottom left spigot is the return from the heater matrix and the bottom right is the return to the engine. So other than the heater matrix return pipe all should fit easily. Click image to enlarge |
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20th Apr 2023 7:22pm |
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| Naks Member Since: 27 Jan 2009 Location: Stellenbosch, ZA Posts: 2638
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Gents, I popped to my LR dealer yesterday, and the part they just received on backorder is not the same as the one in my car.
I had a good look at it, and noticed something: when it's fully closed, the valve in this section is not fully closed - when look through the pipe, I can see a small gap to the back of the unit. Is that a problem? --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear 2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged
Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9 Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ |
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21st Apr 2023 6:47am |
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| Ianh Member Since: 17 Sep 2018 Location: Essex Posts: 2005
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As per above from blackwolf on page 2 of the topic, that’s the way to check the valve. If it is not 100% sealed when doing so it’s faulty. |
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21st Apr 2023 4:47pm |
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